Hi Cheryl1655. The passage you read in Revelation 21:1-3 about the new heaven (sky) & new Earth and then the New Jerusalem coming down from Heaven, are events (including those in Revelation 22) that will take place right at the very end of earthly time as we know it. This account shows us the end of Satan & his influence on mankind, the end of sin & corruption, & the arrival of a complete renewal of God's original creation, with God in the midst. These are glorious visions which the Apostle John received from Jesus for those end times, and sadly the vision of all those who have rejected Jesus & loved to live in sin, hating the God of Heaven, these will go into punishment of everlasting fire ( Revelation 21:8).
"The meeting in the sky" is what I believe you're referring to as the Rapture, or 'the snatching away' (Latin, 'rapio'; Greek, 'harpazo'), and this is referred to in 1 Corinthians 15:51,52 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, which the Apostle Paul's was teaching to those Churches. Now this event (the Rapture) is a subject that has a whole range of views & beliefs amongst Christians, as we piece together what information we're given in the Bible, figuring the how, when, where, this occurs (or, likely to occur). However, to answer your question, my understanding of the Scriptures is that the Rapture ('the lifting up of the living & dead in Christ & meeting Jesus in the sky') is the next great event in God's 'calendar', where His saved, holy ones are removed from the Earth before His Wrath is poured upon the Earth of unbelievers (otherwise called, the Great Tribulation of God's Wrath (see Matthew chapter 24)). See also 1 Thessalonians 1:10 & 1 Thessalonians 5:8-10.
However one views this 'snatching away' & the Day of God's Wrath upon the Earth, the message to those IN CHRIST is clear: BE READY, Live lives pleasing to the Lord, that we may "not be ashamed before Him at His Coming" ( 1 John 2:28,29). GBU.
It would be very much simpler if there was only one person with a given screen name. Sometimes this happens, as I have noticed. But also, I think that some people use multiple screen names, not necessarily to dominate the site, but to give the impression that other people share their same views that some of us have recognized as being aberrant. So, that is another possible reason why some make multiple accounts. It is deceptive and hopefully some of us can recognize it when it occurs. Should we contact admin when we notice this?
Please disregard my last message. I just noticed that there is another user on here with the name Jesse. I am not sure if he is new here or not, but having someone posting with the same user's name as mine could cause confusion. I hope this does not happen. Some websites will not accept a user name that has already been taken but I guess it is okay here. Can you imagine multiple people posting with the same user's name, like Jesse, or Ronald? How would we know who's who?
I am not sure what happened? I replied to Jesse on a question on the if the Jews were the chosen people. If there is another Jesse I do not see how it was sent to your email. You can see his post 17 hours ago.
That is strange, even stranger if the other Jesse gets this.
Hi Natasha St John! If you read in Revelation 7:4-8 It explains that the 144,000 are out of the 12 tribes of Israel. As we read on starting with verse 9 we see that the nations that make up the rest of the world, that have their garments washed white in the blood of the Lamb, are a multitude that no man could number. So the 144,000 are only those that God has sealed, out of the 12 tribes of Israel. Now we know because God's Word is truth and there is a thread in the bible. Isaiah 64:6 says that all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags. In Matthew 7:21-23 says that God will say depart from me ye workers of iniquity. Also in
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 it says, Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God. And in Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. So by fallowing the thread of the Bible we can clearly see that the 144,000 are only out of the 12 tribes of Israel, they are washed in the blood of the Lamb and sealed by God. The rest of the world is the multitude that no man can number and is also washed in the blood of Christ Jesus.
I hope this answers your question.
I always try to remember these verses; 1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
My understanding: Due to the flood all of mankind today are descendants of Adam and Eve through the sons of Noah. We don't look alike but we have the same blood and the same skin, Acts 17:261 Cor. 15:39. Satan has twisted it so that we look at each other as different races when there is only one race created by God through His only begotten Son Jesus.
Today we see people as either Jews or Gentiles with the Gentiles of many religions. We see in Deut. 7:6 God said to Israel "God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto Himself above all people that are upon the face of the earth." If we look at what God said to Abram in Genesis 12:1-3 "and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed," this is pointing to the coming of Jesus.
Israel was chosen by God for his plan of salvation as Jesus said to the woman at the well, John 4:21-24 how we worship the Father is about to change for salvation is of the Jews. Salvation came through Israel the chosen people, who today are called Jews came the chosen One, the Anointed One, the Messiah/Christ Jesus the Son of God. Through Him, all the families of the earth will be blessed. We also see this in Matt. 12:17-21Isaiah 42:1-4
Gal. 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
Gal. 4:4-5 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Whosoever is in Jesus, the Chosen One, by Him becomes the chosen people of God Jew or Gentile. Matt. 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen. Matt. 20:161 Cor. 1:27Eph. 1:4 2 Thes. 2:13 Rev. 17:14. Jesus will return and reign and the chosen will reign with Him.
"For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth."
Is the 144000.00 be the ones that are alive at the coming of Christ ? , the ones that have stayed true to GOD , the ones that have not been killed off by those who have rejected CHRIST I do understand that CHRIST said unless he comes there would be no flesh remain , does this have something to do with it ?, Who really will be the 144000.00?
Hello Skyler. According to Revelation 20:11-15, hell (in Greek, Hades: the abode of the departed spirits), will not last forever. In that very last day when all are judged by God (at the Great White Throne judgement), all those who have died & not found written in the Book of Life, would be found guilty before God & cast into the Lake of Fire. Not only them, but "death & hell" as well, as there would no longer be any need for them, since sin will be no more as Satan himself will be consigned to that fiery Lake (v20) & with him all who have rejected God & His Son Jesus Christ. So, there will be a day when hell will be emptied out & removed altogether, but the Lake of Fire will exist for eternity in the final judgement of those who rejected God's Love.
And Jesus spoke of this final place in Luke 12:4,5: "And I say unto you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him." Here the word for 'hell' in Greek, is 'geenna or gehenna', which is different from the (temporary Hell/Hades). And this place (Gehenna) is the final place of eternal torment; but those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life ( Revelation 21:27) will live eternally with God & His Son, with the host of Heaven, on the new Earth in the New Jerusalem where there will be no more sin & Satan to deceive mankind.
It is written, " than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that shall NEVER BE QUENCHED: where their worm dieth not, and THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED."
Hiya Barbara...Lemme give ya my slant on the lake of fire...And Rev 20:15...One of my favorite scriptures...And Hebrews 12:29....Our God is a consuming fire...and Luke 12:49....I come to bring fire on the earth...Which is his baptism of the H.G. and fire...Which answers to the book of life that NEW covenant in his blood...Plz listen with your heart to Rev 20:15...If any man was not found written in the book of life ( that New Covenant in his blood) he was cast into the lake of fire...Which is that fire that Jesus said he wanted to bring on the earth...That new covenant in his blood...Remember our God is a consuming fire which is baptism of the H.G. and fire...
..... Malachi 3:2 kjv....Who shall abide the day of his coming...( 2 nd coming )...Who shall stand when he appears for he shall be as a REFINERS FIRE and fullers soap a cleasing fire...That FIRE that Jesus wants to bring to all the world...H.G. FIRE...He is gonna wash everyone of us with his spirit...Which is the H.g. the gift of God....I will pour out of my Spirit on all flesh..
.....Thus there will be no more death or hell...As our God is a consuming fire that is gonna consume satan and his angels...Which is mans carnal minds...Satans seat..reAnd that y we must be bornagain of that incorruptible seed which are the words of that NEW COVENANT that he wrote with his own blood....That book of life....Thats y the scrip. is saying if anyman was not found written in the book of life ( washed in the blood of the lamb ) ....He was cast into the lake of fire...Baptism of the H.G and fire...I will pour out of my spirit on ALL FLESH...Thats y Jesus was saying if I
be lifted up ( the blood ) I will draw ALL MEN unto me.
.....Thats y Jesus was saying Every sinner will have his part in the lake of fire...O thank you Jesus...Its God that is that LAKE OF FIRE....Thru baptism of the H.G AND FIRE...Remember Jesus rebuked James and John when they wanted to call down a literal fire on the samartians....Our God is th fire
I understand your question better , fire purges , makes clean , what cannot be cleaned by water shall be cleaned in fire , like gold and silver , fire is used to get rid of the impurities in gold and silver . It's used in Revelation as a metaphor . We will come through that cleansing purge if we are in Christ , everything else will be destroyed by that same fire . The fire will sort the wheat from the chaff , the chaff will be destroyed by the fire but for us in Christ it will cleanse us completely , a bit like the flood in Noah's day , the water was destruction to all those people who didn't believe God but to Noah and his family that water was like a baptism . Think of Daniels companions in the furnace , the flames didn't touch them or harm them because they belonged to God .
The power of death is sin , the flesh (us ) is weak and sinful . When all flesh is done away with satan will have no power to tempt anyone , he will be redundant and there won't be any flesh left for him to tempt into sin . We shall all be changed and be like Christ . God will be all in all , no more weak sinful flesh no more satan .
Hi Barbara. In Revelation 20:14,15, we read about this event that is way into the future. Hell is 'Hades' in Greek, which essentially means, 'the abode of the departed spirits'. According to Revelation 20:11-13, those who stand before God in that final judgement, with the books about their lives opened, have all been dead. And hell will be emptied out of those spirits of men that hated God, their bodies, whether in the earth or in the sea will be raised to stand trial before God. All will be judged and condemned into an eternity of endless torment & horror. The graves will be emptied & hell will be emptied. There's no more need for them. All that is evil & representative of evil will forever be cast aside.
Then the beauty & holiness of the New heaven (sky), the New Earth & the New Jerusalem (Revelation chapter 21), will renew all that was lost when mankind decided to rebel against his Maker.
Hello James. It is my understanding that the new city will be established on the new Earth. The removal of the old Earth, sky & seas are done for the purpose of a full cleansing from the stain of corruption that permeated everything. The New Jerusalem is indicative of a fresh beginning with Satan & his henchmen locked away permanently.
As we enter into verse 8; we have the first of several statements as to the fate of the wicked.
It is hard to even bear thinking about these things without pleading to God for strength. We notice the cowardly state as being the first sin mentioned. We can't do it without the Lord as Peter attempted to do with bravado without the Spirit. Without Him we can do nothing. As we see a parallel verse in Isaiah 66:24 we see the state of man either in hades during the Millennium or during the eternal state. We see how God's mercy and forgiveness are only for when they are in this life; and we also see how they will be an abhorrence to all that see them. There is no way to overstate here how important hearing God's voice is at the present above all of life's distractions and temptations and comforts. I can't see how anyone no matter how mature they are in the Lord isn't broken when considering these things; and ever grateful that God saved them from this unspeakable horror.
The rest of the chapter basically describes heaven coming down to earth and it's dimensions and foundation stones. Again; as stated previously when we consider the affect of a city almost the size of the moon landing on the earth surely the edges would be pressed out and likely the mantle would expose itself to the surface which would allow lava (i.e. the lake of fire) to be outside the gates. We see this also in other verses where Christ warns that heaven will be seen but "you yourselves thrust out" ( Luke 13:28).
There will be some existence of kings on the earth; whether it symbolizes those of the church or those perhaps who lived through the Millennium period bringing glory and honor into it. The doors are not shut day and night (implying that even if the light of the sun and moon aren't NEEDED they still may exist). Again; the last verse is a terrifying reminder that unsaved people will not enter or be able to. They are locked forever in sin.
I would like to look at this book with a LITERAL approach. When we consider the verse in 2 Peter 3:10 we see the same word for smallest particle (signifying an atom) as being dissolved.
Scientists; of course understand the basic structure of the atom and that it is held together by various forces; but ultimately don't understand WHY these exist; along with the concept of decay and or death based on the 2nd law of thermodynamics; gravity; and of course what happened BEFORE the universe came into existence. It seems clear here that when this event occurs; that there is a reconfiguration of the solid matter; and such a fire would immediately vaporize the oceans. (verse 1). When we see in verse 2 a city with these literal dimensions coming down to earth that would facilitate a final change in the structure of the earth and clearly make Jerusalem visible worldwide (being over 1000 miles high.)
Since God follows a logical sequence; we see how when in the vial judgments all life in the sea perished; we have a lifeless ocean that is now completely removed. The prophecy in Ezekiel 47:10-12 shows how fish proliferate in the inland sea area of the Dead Sea during the Millennium and likely beyond as well; with water from the heavenly city brining fresh water to revitalize things (as already is starting to occur).
Verses 3 through 4 show how until this point tears are still part of the lives at least of mortal men. Those who are righteous and stand before the throne seeing all these things happen at the last judgment surely will be overcome with emotion. Their tears are wiped away; and finally there is no mor death; mourning; crying or pain. This reflects 1 Cor 15:26 and an even earlier verse in Hosea where death is finally defeated is mentioned later in the same chapter (v. 55-57). Again; some to justify doctrines try to make these passages symbolic.
How can we not do violence to scriptures doing this?
I was thinking upon this matter last night sort of along the lines that you posted.
I thought, well, of what great significance is it whether Paul or Matthias was the 12th apostle? Really. I don't think that this is a matter to really have a long discussion about, as it does not affect the topics of salvation, the truth about Who God or Jesus is, or the Christian walk. So, thanks for appreciating the discussion between all of us. I, too, find such discussions helpful. It takes me back the Word of God to find truth. That is always a good thing! Blessings to you today.
This is one of those topic that in the end whether Mathias or Paul is the answer, I have had the privileges to have known people like you and others who are willing and able to discuss Bible verses in a Godly way. That alone is very precious in my walk in spirit. I respect your belief on this topic and thank you so much for sharing your point of view. Kind regards. Agape.
"The meeting in the sky" is what I believe you're referring to as the Rapture, or 'the snatching away' (Latin, 'rapio'; Greek, 'harpazo'), and this is referred to in 1 Corinthians 15:51,52 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, which the Apostle Paul's was teaching to those Churches. Now this event (the Rapture) is a subject that has a whole range of views & beliefs amongst Christians, as we piece together what information we're given in the Bible, figuring the how, when, where, this occurs (or, likely to occur). However, to answer your question, my understanding of the Scriptures is that the Rapture ('the lifting up of the living & dead in Christ & meeting Jesus in the sky') is the next great event in God's 'calendar', where His saved, holy ones are removed from the Earth before His Wrath is poured upon the Earth of unbelievers (otherwise called, the Great Tribulation of God's Wrath (see Matthew chapter 24)). See also 1 Thessalonians 1:10 & 1 Thessalonians 5:8-10.
However one views this 'snatching away' & the Day of God's Wrath upon the Earth, the message to those IN CHRIST is clear: BE READY, Live lives pleasing to the Lord, that we may "not be ashamed before Him at His Coming" ( 1 John 2:28,29). GBU.
It would be very much simpler if there was only one person with a given screen name. Sometimes this happens, as I have noticed. But also, I think that some people use multiple screen names, not necessarily to dominate the site, but to give the impression that other people share their same views that some of us have recognized as being aberrant. So, that is another possible reason why some make multiple accounts. It is deceptive and hopefully some of us can recognize it when it occurs. Should we contact admin when we notice this?
Please disregard my last message. I just noticed that there is another user on here with the name Jesse. I am not sure if he is new here or not, but having someone posting with the same user's name as mine could cause confusion. I hope this does not happen. Some websites will not accept a user name that has already been taken but I guess it is okay here. Can you imagine multiple people posting with the same user's name, like Jesse, or Ronald? How would we know who's who?
Anyways, blessings to you, my brother!
I am not sure what happened? I replied to Jesse on a question on the if the Jews were the chosen people. If there is another Jesse I do not see how it was sent to your email. You can see his post 17 hours ago.
That is strange, even stranger if the other Jesse gets this.
RLW
I am not sure why you are sharing this with me but thank you! Did you mean to send this to someone else?
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 it says, Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God. And in Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. So by fallowing the thread of the Bible we can clearly see that the 144,000 are only out of the 12 tribes of Israel, they are washed in the blood of the Lamb and sealed by God. The rest of the world is the multitude that no man can number and is also washed in the blood of Christ Jesus.
I hope this answers your question.
I always try to remember these verses; 1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
My understanding: Due to the flood all of mankind today are descendants of Adam and Eve through the sons of Noah. We don't look alike but we have the same blood and the same skin, Acts 17:26 1 Cor. 15:39. Satan has twisted it so that we look at each other as different races when there is only one race created by God through His only begotten Son Jesus.
Today we see people as either Jews or Gentiles with the Gentiles of many religions. We see in Deut. 7:6 God said to Israel "God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto Himself above all people that are upon the face of the earth." If we look at what God said to Abram in Genesis 12:1-3 "and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed," this is pointing to the coming of Jesus.
Israel was chosen by God for his plan of salvation as Jesus said to the woman at the well, John 4:21-24 how we worship the Father is about to change for salvation is of the Jews. Salvation came through Israel the chosen people, who today are called Jews came the chosen One, the Anointed One, the Messiah/Christ Jesus the Son of God. Through Him, all the families of the earth will be blessed. We also see this in Matt. 12:17-21 Isaiah 42:1-4
Gal. 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
Gal. 4:4-5 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Whosoever is in Jesus, the Chosen One, by Him becomes the chosen people of God Jew or Gentile. Matt. 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen. Matt. 20:16 1 Cor. 1:27 Eph. 1:4 2 Thes. 2:13 Rev. 17:14. Jesus will return and reign and the chosen will reign with Him.
God bless,
RLW
"For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth."
And Jesus spoke of this final place in Luke 12:4,5: "And I say unto you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him." Here the word for 'hell' in Greek, is 'geenna or gehenna', which is different from the (temporary Hell/Hades). And this place (Gehenna) is the final place of eternal torment; but those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life ( Revelation 21:27) will live eternally with God & His Son, with the host of Heaven, on the new Earth in the New Jerusalem where there will be no more sin & Satan to deceive mankind.
It is written, " than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that shall NEVER BE QUENCHED: where their worm dieth not, and THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED."
Mark 943-44
..... Malachi 3:2 kjv....Who shall abide the day of his coming...( 2 nd coming )...Who shall stand when he appears for he shall be as a REFINERS FIRE and fullers soap a cleasing fire...That FIRE that Jesus wants to bring to all the world...H.G. FIRE...He is gonna wash everyone of us with his spirit...Which is the H.g. the gift of God....I will pour out of my Spirit on all flesh..
.....Thus there will be no more death or hell...As our God is a consuming fire that is gonna consume satan and his angels...Which is mans carnal minds...Satans seat..reAnd that y we must be bornagain of that incorruptible seed which are the words of that NEW COVENANT that he wrote with his own blood....That book of life....Thats y the scrip. is saying if anyman was not found written in the book of life ( washed in the blood of the lamb ) ....He was cast into the lake of fire...Baptism of the H.G and fire...I will pour out of my spirit on ALL FLESH...Thats y Jesus was saying if I
be lifted up ( the blood ) I will draw ALL MEN unto me.
.....Thats y Jesus was saying Every sinner will have his part in the lake of fire...O thank you Jesus...Its God that is that LAKE OF FIRE....Thru baptism of the H.G AND FIRE...Remember Jesus rebuked James and John when they wanted to call down a literal fire on the samartians....Our God is th fire
Then the beauty & holiness of the New heaven (sky), the New Earth & the New Jerusalem (Revelation chapter 21), will renew all that was lost when mankind decided to rebel against his Maker.
As we enter into verse 8; we have the first of several statements as to the fate of the wicked.
It is hard to even bear thinking about these things without pleading to God for strength. We notice the cowardly state as being the first sin mentioned. We can't do it without the Lord as Peter attempted to do with bravado without the Spirit. Without Him we can do nothing. As we see a parallel verse in Isaiah 66:24 we see the state of man either in hades during the Millennium or during the eternal state. We see how God's mercy and forgiveness are only for when they are in this life; and we also see how they will be an abhorrence to all that see them. There is no way to overstate here how important hearing God's voice is at the present above all of life's distractions and temptations and comforts. I can't see how anyone no matter how mature they are in the Lord isn't broken when considering these things; and ever grateful that God saved them from this unspeakable horror.
The rest of the chapter basically describes heaven coming down to earth and it's dimensions and foundation stones. Again; as stated previously when we consider the affect of a city almost the size of the moon landing on the earth surely the edges would be pressed out and likely the mantle would expose itself to the surface which would allow lava (i.e. the lake of fire) to be outside the gates. We see this also in other verses where Christ warns that heaven will be seen but "you yourselves thrust out" ( Luke 13:28).
There will be some existence of kings on the earth; whether it symbolizes those of the church or those perhaps who lived through the Millennium period bringing glory and honor into it. The doors are not shut day and night (implying that even if the light of the sun and moon aren't NEEDED they still may exist). Again; the last verse is a terrifying reminder that unsaved people will not enter or be able to. They are locked forever in sin.
Men are deceived into thinking they can do almost any thing . Scriptures tell us we can not change the color of our hair , why worry about the rest ?
I often think God must laugh at man's vain attempts. How about climate change for example
Have no faith in men or their logic . It's all vanity . In light of truth .
I would like to look at this book with a LITERAL approach. When we consider the verse in 2 Peter 3:10 we see the same word for smallest particle (signifying an atom) as being dissolved.
Scientists; of course understand the basic structure of the atom and that it is held together by various forces; but ultimately don't understand WHY these exist; along with the concept of decay and or death based on the 2nd law of thermodynamics; gravity; and of course what happened BEFORE the universe came into existence. It seems clear here that when this event occurs; that there is a reconfiguration of the solid matter; and such a fire would immediately vaporize the oceans. (verse 1). When we see in verse 2 a city with these literal dimensions coming down to earth that would facilitate a final change in the structure of the earth and clearly make Jerusalem visible worldwide (being over 1000 miles high.)
Since God follows a logical sequence; we see how when in the vial judgments all life in the sea perished; we have a lifeless ocean that is now completely removed. The prophecy in Ezekiel 47:10-12 shows how fish proliferate in the inland sea area of the Dead Sea during the Millennium and likely beyond as well; with water from the heavenly city brining fresh water to revitalize things (as already is starting to occur).
Verses 3 through 4 show how until this point tears are still part of the lives at least of mortal men. Those who are righteous and stand before the throne seeing all these things happen at the last judgment surely will be overcome with emotion. Their tears are wiped away; and finally there is no mor death; mourning; crying or pain. This reflects 1 Cor 15:26 and an even earlier verse in Hosea where death is finally defeated is mentioned later in the same chapter (v. 55-57). Again; some to justify doctrines try to make these passages symbolic.
How can we not do violence to scriptures doing this?
I was thinking upon this matter last night sort of along the lines that you posted.
I thought, well, of what great significance is it whether Paul or Matthias was the 12th apostle? Really. I don't think that this is a matter to really have a long discussion about, as it does not affect the topics of salvation, the truth about Who God or Jesus is, or the Christian walk. So, thanks for appreciating the discussion between all of us. I, too, find such discussions helpful. It takes me back the Word of God to find truth. That is always a good thing! Blessings to you today.
This is one of those topic that in the end whether Mathias or Paul is the answer, I have had the privileges to have known people like you and others who are willing and able to discuss Bible verses in a Godly way. That alone is very precious in my walk in spirit. I respect your belief on this topic and thank you so much for sharing your point of view. Kind regards. Agape.
knew that for Paul to believe his Son had to appear to him. Also acts 1:25 it is written That he mathias may take part of
this ministry and apostleship from which Judas by transgression fell. agapeo to you also this is what I see.