Bible Discussion Thread

 
  • Jesse - 3 days ago
    (1 Thessalonians Part 11):

    1 Thessalonians 4:14 - For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

    For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and the word "if" is 1st Class Condition, meaning it's true. It's translated since. For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also, and notice this: which sleep in Jesus God will bring with him.

    How do you bring dead people with you if they're in the grave? They're asleep in Jesus. Their physical body is in the grave. They are absent from the body and present with the Lord, and when the Lord comes back, they come back with Him.

    1 Thessalonians 4:16 - For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

    For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout. The word shout, KALUO, is the word for command. He's just not going to yell. He's going to give a command.
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 19 hours ago
    What does 144 signify?

    "and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand," St John sees the Lamb,

    God set 12x10 as a rule. "yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years." Gospel is tagged by the Spirit by 12 while the Law of the Spirit sets 7 as a rule. So judgment on the disobedient is set in seven angels with trumpets and seven vials etc.,

    12x10 refers to man's life. For a believer it is 12x12. The reason is simple. He that has the Son has the Father as well. So he who is saved by the gospel of Christ has also the gospel of God. Thus 144 explains the saints redeemed from the earth and set in heavenly places. Correspondingly in our flesh and blood we represent them. 144x1000 explains our volume for the reason mentioned in my earlier post.

    Volume of the holy city is 12000x12000x12000 (Rev.21.16) We are all members of the body of Christ.
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Jesse,

    It pleased God that in Christ Jesus all his fulness should dwell. He has finished his earthly ministry. But there is a final gathering. "And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven." So the Spirit expressly speaks of the event. There is an order and the sequence is for God to decide. There are those 'sanctified ones' tagged by 144x1000 and those who are alive at his coming,
  • Jesse - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Bennymkje,

    Thank you for sharing a portion of Colossians Chapter 1 and Revelation Chapter 7. Yes, I agree with you that there is an order and sequence and that it is for God to decide. It's a good thing that He didn't leave it up to us. What a mess we would be in if that were the case!
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Jesse,

    A correction:

    I did not quote from Rev.7 but from Rev.14 Blessings under the Covenant is for a believer on the basis of the Gospel of God which God the Son fulfilled in human likeness. So Matt.5 we have the doctrine of God presented under the Beatitudes. These covered in chs 5-7 he fulfilled in his earthly ministry.

    What are the blessings? It is set forth in 7 days of Gen.1 to ch.2.1-3. We are blessed in him,"of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:/ According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love" (Eph.1.3-4) We are covered in heavenly place as we are enjoined while in our bodies to be holy and without before him in love. So we have a volume. It is what the holy city shows. Length and Breadth and Height are equal.144 is a tag to indicate this volume of believers collective expressed. There is only one measurement (Rev.21.17) Those who standing on mount Sion and we who are alive shall be of one measure. What Rev.7 refers a remnant stepping into the breach as Seth did.

    The Covenant is a legal document with 7 bullet points explaining the various blessings. Ancient of days is the Law of the Spirit. Like the term Rapture the Holy Spirit does not name it everlasting covenant but the beast 6-6-6 is damned in body spirit and soul. Because he choose not to enter into the rest of God, the day Sen sanctified by God. Without faith you cannot please God.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 3 days ago
    (1 Thessalonians Part 15):

    1 Thessalonians 5:24 - Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

    It says faithful is he that calls you, and the word calls is a participle, the one who is continually calling you. He's continually calling me to Him right now. I responded several years ago. And I'm still responding to Him. He's still calling.

    But notice this: faithful is He who is calling you, who also will do it. Paul just said may he preserve your whole spirit, soul, and body, may He preserve you blameless. He will do it. It's a promise!

    1 Thessalonians 5:28 - The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ is with you. It's a proclamation, not a benediction. The word "be" is in italics because it's added. There's no verb in Greek. He's stating fact. The grace of the Lord is with you. Amen.

    Another book down. I will begin with 2 Thessalonians soon, Lord willing!

    Blessings in Christ!
  • S Spencer - In Reply - 3 days ago
    Thanks again Brother Jesse.

    God bless you.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 3 days ago
    Brother Spencer,

    You are welcome and thank you for sticking with this from the beginning. And may the Lord continue to bless you also! I should be ready to start posting on 2 Thessalonians, hopefully by tomorrow. It's been quite the journey thus far and I am grateful for you and a few others who have been following along and giving me the encouragement to see this through. If it wasn't for you and those who have been blessed by some of the things I've shared, I would have probably stopped way back in Matthew after the individual who asked me to do this falsely accused me of discrediting the Holy Spirit and then left this forum all together.

    God Bless!!!
  • S Spencer - In Reply - 3 days ago
    Brother Jesse These postings is a treasure. I've started a file with them beginning with Matthew for further study and sharing.

    I thank God for blessing you with the endurance to do this!!

    God bless
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 days ago
    Brother Jesse, I join with bro S. Spencer in appreciation of all your hard work going through the NT & picking out certain verses that needed clarification from the original language - which of course, must be very helpful to the serious Bible student.

    Yes, I remember the reason why you began this series of notes, but I suspect that the person who questioned you & enquired further from you, is doubtless amazed by the extent of your response. I'm sure that even a few examples of why the KJV, indeed any translation into any other language from the original, can never be exact, is simply because of the nature of language itself & the ideas & culture behind them. As well, how we read it in our language is very often colored by our own perceptions or predispositions, making the original given text at variance to what we ought to be reading & understanding. I too, will always stick with the KJB, but your efforts have indeed added much more to my understanding & appreciation of the Word, as the actual intended message from the writers are revealed - and all these harmonize with the rest of Scripture. Blessings brother & be encouraged further to complete this huge task.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 2 days ago
    Brothers Chris and Spencer,

    Again, I want to thank you both. As I've mentioned in the past, the King James will always be my bible of choice even though it is not perfect. I own several bibles, all various KJB versions with the exception of a Living Bible (LB) that was given to me by my mother 46 years ago as I was leaving for the military. As you know, the LB is a paraphrase so I do not use that one for any study. In fact, it's been in a box of storage items for many years. Not sure why mom gave me that because she only reads the KJB. I guess she figured that it would be easier for me to read. Several years later, she was shocked when I read to her some of the things from the LB. Anyway, enough of that!

    Chris, I read through everything you shared with brother Giannis. Wow! It is truly amazing to see how the Lord works in people's lives, so thank you so much for sharing your experiences!

    God Bless you both, along with all who visit this forum.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 3 days ago
    (1 Thessalonians Part 14):

    1 Thessalonians 5:16 - Rejoice evermore.

    Rejoice always. This means continue to rejoice. It's a command. Be rejoicing always. Pretty short and sweet!

    1 Thessalonians 5:17 - Pray without ceasing.

    Next, be continually praying without ceasing. It means to be continually talking with the Lord. Don't leave off from praying.

    1 Thessalonians 5:19 - Quench not the Spirit.

    Stop quenching the Spirit. The word quench means to hinder. How can you hinder God's Spirit? Very easily! There can be disturbances. Somebody could come in the room and be shouting and yelling and break up what God's doing, causing distractions. But it's also a command for leaders. Don't be in a position where you hinder God's Spirit from ministering.

    1 Thessalonians 5:23 - And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    He says, and the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; that is completely, and that your whole spirit, soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    A human being is made up of three elements: spirit, soul, and body. And the word soul is the word PSUECHE for your mind, your psyche. So, he's praying for God to preserve and make a believer's spirit, soul, and body complete until He comes.

    It's interesting because people say why would He keep the body because it's evil? No, it's not. The body isn't evil. What the body is made of is evil, flesh! Flesh is evil. The body is the temple of the Holy Spirit. The body is the container. It contains my spirit. It contains Christ's Spirit. But what my body is made of has the law of sin in it. So, the body isn't evil. It's the flesh of the body that is evil.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 3 days ago
    (1 Thessalonians Part 13):

    In Acts 1:9-11, when Jesus ascended up into heaven, He disappeared into the clouds, and the angels told the disciples the same way that you have seen the Lord leave is the same way you will see Him come back. We will be caught up together with them in the clouds for a meeting with the Lord in the air. And therefore comfort one another with these words.

    1 Thessalonians 5:2 - For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

    For you yourselves know perfectly, which is a Greek word that's a mathematical term, AKRIBOS, which means accurately. You yourselves know accurately that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.

    The day of the Lord is exactly what it says. It is not a specific day. It is a time period that God has set apart, even in the Old Testament. It will be His day. The Lords Day is coming. It's not a specific day. It's a time period. It's judgment time. But when it does come, it will come like a thief in the night. People will not be expecting it. It's going to come suddenly.

    1 Thessalonians 5:6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

    It says therefore, and I'll share some technical things here about the translation. Instead of let us not sleep, it's literally we should not sleep. It's not a command. It says we should not sleep, as do the others; but let us watch and be sober.

    1 Thessalonians 5:15 - See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.

    The word evil is the word adversity. If people cause you problems, he's saying don't turn around and do the same thing to them. But follow that which is good, and that's the word AGATHOS which is spiritual good, both among yourselves, and to all men. In other words, if people cause adversity for you, pursue the good of God and the influence of His Spirit in the situation, and don't repay evil for evil.
  • Jesse - In Reply - 3 days ago
    (1 Thessalonians Part 12):

    1 Thessalonians 4:17 - Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    More literally, then afterwards in sequence, we which are alive and are remaining shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, for a meeting of the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    The phrase "caught up together" is the Greek word HARPADZO which means to snatch up by force. It's used for a bird, like an owl that will swoop down and snatch up a mouse. And it's used for the Lord coming and snatching up His people. In fact, it's the same word in Latin (RAPTUS), which is where we get rapture from. It comes from the Latin Vulgate.

    Some say that there is no rapture because there's no such word in the bible. Obviously, they don't understand that RAPTUS is the Latin word for the Greek word HARPADZO which means to snatch away or seize by force.

    So, we which are alive and remain will be caught up together with them. They come up out of the grave first, and we get caught up with them to where when we get to the Lord, we get there at the same time. It will be simultaneous, though their action starts first, which is very understandable because they're underground and we're above ground.

    1 Thessalonians 4:18 - Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

    The word comfort is the word encouragement. He's showing them the procedure. He says don't worry about those who have died before you because this is what's going to happen. They will come back with the Lord in spirit, their bodies will be raised up first. And then we which live and remain will be caught up together. Our spirit is still in our body. By the time we all reach into the presence of the Lord in the clouds, our bodies will be changed into a spiritual body and we will forever be with Him.
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 12 hours ago
    Jesse,

    I just reread your post and this passage struck me where fowls in mid-air do just what you describe. "The phrase "caught up together" is the Greek word HARPADZO which means to snatch up by force. It's used for a bird, like an owl that will swoop down and snatch up a mouse. And it's used for the Lord coming and snatching up His people. In fact, it's the same word in Latin (RAPTUS), which is where we get rapture from. It comes from the Latin Vulgate."

    Now this passage " And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

    18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great."Rev.19.17-18 Jesus also refers "For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

    28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together." (Mt.24.27-28)
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Hey Jesse,

    Thank you once again, brother, for doing this. When someone argues that there is no rapture simply because the word "rapture" doesn't appear in the Bible, that reasoning feels unsubstantiated. I won't say much more, just a question or two for anyone who wants to study this topic further. It's not about the term "rapture" itself; it's about where we go after the gathering together. Is that destination heaven or earth? Will the rapture occur before or after the beast rises? Other things in these verses, I'm sure they will come up again, do not want to interrupt your work on this project.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • Jesse - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Hello again Ronald,

    Those are all great questions that have been asked and covered in the past by several of us here, and those answers can be found by those inquiring in the pages of scripture. We can point someone to the scriptures, but it is ultimately up to them to study it out for themselves. I agree that these questions will no doubt come up again, and when they do, it should provoke some interesting reading!

    Blessings to you also my brother!


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