Bible Discussion Thread

Is Jesus and God the same person

Read all of the scriptures and ignore the cultists who stray from God's Word or distort scripture. Even children can understand what these verses mean so I think some adults are just wanting to reinforce what they already want to believe, because it's convenient for other reasons. Is a Christian a real Christ follower if he doesn't believe in the divinity of Christ? That is something we should pray deeply and study deeply about.

1 John 5:7

Genesis 1:26

Genesis 11:6-7

John 10:30

John 8:19

John 1:1

Philippians 2:5 - 2:8

2 Corinthians 5:19

John 1:3

1 John 5:7

Matthew 28:19

1 Peter 1:2

2 Corinthians 13:14

Deuteronomy 6:4

John 14:10

John 20:28

1 John 5:8

1 John 2:22-24

Isaiah 7:14 - Jesus is called Immanuel which means "God with us"

Matthew 1:23-25

Sister Bonnie,

Yes, I believe they are ONE.

Jesus said the following in:

Revelation 1:8

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty."

God bless.

Hi Bonnie, Yes to your question. Here are some (for there are many) scriptures to look at; Matt. 10:30, John 8:58-59,( the" I am" in John 8 is the same "I am" used in Ex. 3:14 when God spoke to Moses), 1Tim.3:16, John 1:1-14, to mention a few, hope this helped. God Bless.

So you are saying God died and raised himself from the dead and when jesus Christ talked to His Father He was talking to Himself and don't get rude they are honest questions.

This sounds like an intellectually disingenuous question. Even children understand the concept of the Godhead or trinity- it's straight from God's word. If you don't understand it, that's fine, have you tried praying for wisdom and understanding. It's possible some of these comments are games a person is playing to try to pull some away from the truth to his cult-like beliefs not from the Bible. That's like doing the work of the devil. Here's some good reading material for the cultists.

1 John 5:7

Genesis 1:26

Genesis 11:6-7

John 10:30

John 8:19

John 1:1

Philippians 2:5 - 2:8

2 Corinthians 5:19

John 1:3

1 John 5:7

Matthew 28:19

1 Peter 1:2

2 Corinthians 13:14

Deuteronomy 6:4

John 14:10

John 20:28

1 John 5:8

1 John 2:22-24

Isaiah 7:14 - Jesus is called Immanuel which means "God with us"

Matthew 1:23-25

Adam, Excellent! "Even children understand the concept of the Godhead or trinity- it's straight from God's word." Yes, child-like faith! They can easily see the "triune" concept all over God's Creation, Also. ie:

THREE time, space, and matter = ONE universe!

THREE proton, neutron, and electron = ONE atom!! etc, etc, etc...

Back to God's Word Of Truth:

THREE body AND soul AND spirit = ONE human ( 1 Thessalonians 5:23)!!! Amen?

Your Link usage DISRUPTS the possibility of conversation in this Comment Room.

I'd report it but there's no button.

Try actual conversation.

Micheal, God can not die He is a Spirit, "God is a Spirit and they that worship him,,," John 4:24, however the form that he took, the flesh , the body can and did and yes it was the Spirit that raised that body out of the grave. I encourage you to read the whole chapter of Romans 7. I hope this helps. God Bless.

Verses showing God speaking to Jesus and one of the Holy Spirit in the form of a dove for John the Baptist to witness:

Matthew 3:17

And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

Luke 9:35

And there came a voice out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

Mark 1:11

And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

Mark 9:7

And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

Luke 3:22

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, AND a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

Matthew 17:5

While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

Following are verses clearly of the Godhead speaking to each other:

The Scriptures about the Godhead. Sometimes called "Let Us..." in some passages. These scriptures are evidence of all 3 persons of the Godhead speaking to each other.

Genesis 1:26, 3:22, 11:7

Isaiah 6:8

Romans 1:20

Colossians 2:9

Acts 17:27-30

1 John 5:7

John 10:30

"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and GODHEAD so that they are without excuse:"

Genesis 1:1

The Father purposes

The Word (Jesus) speaks. ( John 1:1)

The Spirit (Holy Spirit) executes the spoken word. Action.

All working together. Jesus came to show us the Father, as Emmanuel.

Matthew 1:23

Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, "God with us."

You may want to note these verses inside your Bible cover.

Bless your patience, Mishael

Jesus is Gods son , that's the record of God . Are you your father ? No difference. Yes you came from him but that's it .

Part 3 The LORD JESUS CHRIST Is God Almighty

And, Finally, WHO Is God, The JUDGE Of All?

13) God Almighty Is The JUDGE Of All!

And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the

same, that thou shalt escape The Judgment Of God? But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself Wrath against The Day Of Wrath and Revelation Of The Righteous JUDGMENT Of God! ( Romans 2 : 3, 5)

...God The JUDGE of all!...God Will JUDGE! ( Hebrews 12 : 23, 13 : 4)

...Strong Is The LORD God Who JUDGES!... ( Revelation 18 : 8)

JESUS CHRIST Is God, Because All The Verses In The Holy BIBLE,That Talk About GOD Being The JUDGE, Must Refer To JESUS CHRIST,SinceHEAloneJUDGES! The Father JUDGES no man! ( John 5 : 22)

The Father Has Committed All JUDGMENT To His SON, The LORD JESUS CHRIST!! ( John 5 : 22) Why?

"That All men should honour The SON, even asthey honour The Father. He that honoureth not The SON honoureth not The Father Who Hath Sent HIM!" ( John 5 : 23)

Precious friend, Bonnie, please be enriched, enlightened, and edified In The Triune GodHead!!!

That's a lot of smoke but where is the fire ?

Just one verse where Jesus confesses who he is !

God of the Old Testament hundreds of times said confessed who he is ! God and God alone .

Jesus never made that claim " I AM God "

Jesus is the son of God , came from God . All that Jesus received was from the father . The Father made Jesus everything he is , that's why Jesus called God father ,and the father called Jesus his son .

Thanks for your attention to facts , read about it in the Bible .

Not sure how you like these verses in the Bible then, because it clearly says Jesus is God. To deny this is to deny God's word:

1 John 5:7 "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."

John 10:30 "I and my Father are one."

John 8:19 "if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also."

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

"the Word was God."

That's hard to deny that truth. Let's read that again.

"the Word was God."

And it sounds like you're saying "the Word wasn't God." The Bible says one thing, you're saying another- the opposite.

Satan is the father of lies and he is no doubt behind every major deception, especially among Christians. A Christian is a Christ follower. Does that term bother you since you deny the above verses about His diety? This twisting of scripture in order to achieve a certain narrative seems awfully like the CNN version of the Bible.

Let's continue with more truth in scripture to refute the false assumptions posted here...

Philippians 2:5 - 2:8 "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"

John 1:3 - All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Matthew 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:"

Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:"

John 14:10 "Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."

John 20:28

"And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God."

1 John 5:8 "And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one."

Bob, Jesus told Satan He was God when He was being tempted, 3 separate times, time would not permit me to tell you about the sermon on the mount or about the "b attitudes" and I think that's where we as professed Christians have erred in that we gave these "lessons" knick names or "casual titles" of teachings when in fact a lot of what Jesus taught or said was either law or he made an adjustments to that law, because he came to fulfil it Matt 5:17-18 when Jesus said that he in a sense gave himself a death sentence because only one person could do that in the eyes of the Jews and that is God(the Jews only believed in 1 God) another example is found in Matt 5:27-28 every Jew will tell you that it was God who instituted the laws but here we have Jesus making adjustments to them that's why the Jews wanted him killed, another time, John 10:30-31 ask any orthodox Jew who the Father is and they will tell you Jehovah, or Lord, or God yet Jesus just professed to them "I and my Father(which is Spirit) are one. Hoped this helped. God Bless!

What a great list of very relevant Scripture showing the full Deity of our Lord Jesus. I was greatly enriched indeed GRACE_ambassador. I was looking for possibly a reference ( John 20:28) in your list, but may have missed it. We can note how Jesus never rebuked Thomas for exclaiming, "My Lord and my God". Rather, Thomas' faithlessness was addressed & now he believed & rejoiced in seeing his Master & his God. And how blessed are those who haven't been witnesses of those crucifixion wounds on the Lord, & still have faith to believe & call upon Him.

As I went out for my evening walk today, my mind & spirit was deeply impressed with a situation where a believer denies the deity of Christ & the impact that has on his salvation. And then coming to your three page response, I saw your question I had entertained a hour earlier, i.e. "If we Deny HIS Deity, how can HE FORGIVE us our sins?" I'm still working through that because of the gravity of its implications. Doesn't our salvation hinge on the fact that God laid down His Life for us? That the salvation He brought to us was "once for all" ( Hebrews 10:4-12)? Thank you for those great Scriptures giving irrefutable evidence of the Deity of Christ.

Precious brother Chris, thanks so much for your kind words of encouragement! I did have your verse in my list of over 150 Scriptures for The LORD JESUS CHRIST As Being The Almighty God! It was #:

113. JESUS CHRIST is Called "My God" ( John 20:28). Since there is "no other God" ( Isaiah 45:5) ( Isaiah 45:21-22), This Plainly And Clearly Declares, According To The Word Of Truth, That JESUS CHRIST is That God.

Your Excellent statement: "We can note how Jesus never rebuked Thomas for exclaiming, "My Lord and my God," can Certainly be connected With Confirming Scriptures, about "rebuking worship," {# 9 on my Previous list...}:

"And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy." ( Revelation 19:10)

"And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God. ( Revelation 22:8-9)

May you and all who "believe God's Word Of Truth," Please Be Richly Encouraged and Edified, waiting for our Great God And Saviour, JESUS CHRIST! ( Titus 2:13)

brother Chris Endrizzi

Chris , Christ likens himself to the brassen serpent in the wilderness , I'm going to assume that you know all about this . What happened to that brassen serpent ? I'm going to assume that you know that one of the good kings of Israel destroyed it . He destroyed this brassen serpent on a wooden stick , the same one that Jesus likens himself to , because....people were worshipping it . To me it doesn't get much clearer than that . My beliefs are based on the words that are written in the whole Bible , it's all there for us . Respectfully in Christ . This isn't a debate able subject for me ,I'm sure it isn't for you either .

Thank you Sacha. I'm familiar with that account in Numbers 21:5-9 & 2 Kings 18:1-4. I see that you understand this account of the brazen serpent as becoming an idol to the children of Israel, which was subsequently destroyed by King Hezekiah. And you are correct, in part.

However, when Jesus referred to this brazen serpent in John 3:11-15, He spoke of the reason why the brazen serpent on the pole was constructed in the first place (i.e. in Numbers 21) & that it was for the same reason that He was referring to it now (i.e. in John's Gospel). And the reason was that, as the Israelites were condemned to death for their complaining & unbelief, so too are each one of us condemned to death for our unbelief & rejection of God. The only way the Israelites could find 'life' was to gaze upon that serpent on the pole (i.e. they needed to express faith in God & not murmur against Him in unbelief). And the only way for the unbeliever, post-Cross, to find 'life' is to gaze upon Jesus on the Cross.

These accounts are given to show that faith & belief in what God has provided are needed to gain 'life' & not death. It was not meant to show the wrong worship of an idol (which is of course why Hezekiah ultimately destroyed it). Jesus can be worshipped whether He is on the Cross (as we come in repentance & faith), or in Heaven (seated at the Father's right Hand) in full equality with the Father but now as reigning as the Word made flesh & in resurrection glory. So the point of Jesus' message was: 'as the serpent was raised up & those who looked upon it in faith, survived, so also Jesus was raised on the Cross for the faithless ones to look upon Him & live. At least that is my understanding of His Message.

Thomas recognized that God was in Jesus and raised him up .

He went from total believer from unbeliever . You only assume Jesus never corrected him . You know what assuming does ?

I know and believe that Jesus was raised up by the power of God in Jesus , the same power that will raise all believers up in the first resurrection, does that mean we are God ? No but the power of God is with us to do so . At that time .

Everyone that believes Jesus is the Som of God and confessed him , God dwells in them . Does that make them God ? Of course not . Born of God yes .

Hi Ron. Actually, I don't believe I've made an assumption. To call a person, "God", must bring on the sternest rebuke if spoken in error. Thomas should have been corrected about that erroneous statement & the matter should not have slipped by; rather, the Lord recognized that faith had come to Thomas only because of his present (visual) witness of Jesus, rather than simply believing what He had earlier spoken about His death & resurrection ( Matthew 16:21).

In Matthew 22:41-46: Christ baffled the Pharisees when he asked them what thoughts they had of the promised Messiah. How could the Christ possibly be the Son of David and yet be his Lord? Jesus quotes Ps 110:1. If the Messiah was to be a mere man (even if it was a very special creation unlike any other), & who would not exist till many ages after King David's death, how could His forefather (David) call him Lord? The Pharisees could give no answer.

Nor can anyone solve the difficulty except he allows the Messiah to be the Son of God, & David's Lord be equally with the Father. He took upon himself human nature, and so became God manifested in the flesh; in this sense he is both the Son of Man and the Son of David. This compels us to ask, 'what think we of Christ?' Is He altogether glorious in our eyes, and precious to our hearts? When Jesus said, "O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I HAD WITH THEE before the world was" ( John 17:5), was Jesus deceiving His disciples & us with an incredible prayer & giving rise to suspicion? Or, was He now expectantly looking towards that Glory that He had set aside to become man for the sake of our redeeming men's evil hearts & minds?

Hi Chris,

The Apostle John also supports what you are saying in John 5:18 :

"Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God."

Typo on the word Son not som .

I'd like to know where in the Bible it says we need to believe that Jesus is God ?

We do need to believe that Jesus is the Christ . The Christ is sent by God , known as the Son of God .

I believe that the trinity doctrine is Roman Catholicism.

So even people that do not claim to be Roman Catholic actually are in their confession of their deities . 3 not the 1 of the Bible .

Yes!! Thank you Grace ambassador!

Wow! I concur Chris that was (is) an impressive list and you are right to think along the lines of our salvation or belief in the gospel of Christ being impacted by our belief or revelations we have pertaining to the diety of God I believe there is a scripture that says: "if we or an angel from heaven preach any other gospel unto than that we have preached unto to you, let him be accursed." Gal.1:8..something to think about. In Christ Gerald.

Gerald Your scripture reference was given long before the deity of Christ was questioned and the context of what Paul wrote was explaining who he received the gospel from they were not believing what he was saying. He taught them the Gospel and in Galatians 3:1 Who hath hindered you that you should not obey the truth. That's the context.

The Deity of Jesus was questioned when he was born. Herod had all the young children slain because he felt threatened (Matt. chapter 2).

John, Help me, are you saying that the "gospel"(good news) that Paul was referring to came from Jesus? I want to know because he used some strong words "let him be accursed"(Grk. anathema). I just want to get it right. In Christ, Gerald.

Part 2 The LORD JESUS CHRIST Is God Almighty

9) JESUS CHRIST was WORSHIPPED!

( Matthew 2 : 11, 14 : 33, 28 : 9; Luke 24 : 52)

Not once did JESUS Say, "See thou do it not,"

as "an angel NOT to be worshipped,"spoke

in Revelation 19 : 10, And, 22 : 8-9!

Since ONLY The LORD God is to be worshipped!

( Exodus 34 : 14; Psalms 29 : 2, 45 : 11, 86 : 9, et al;

Matthew 4 : 10; Luke 4 : 8; Revelation 22 : 9):

Holy SCRIPTURE Clearly Teaches us JESUS CHRIST Is God!

10) Every knee shall bow, and "every tongue"

shall confess to GOD! ( Romans 14 : 11; Isaiah 45 : 21-23).

The GOD "every tongue is confessing to,"

Is The LORD JESUS CHRIST! ( Philippians 2 : 11)

11) JESUS CHRIST Is Called The SAVIOUR!

( Luke 2 : 11; Acts 5 : 30-31, 13 : 23; Titus 1 : 4, 2 : 13)

( 2 Peter 1 : 1, 11, 2 : 20, 3 : 18, 1 John 4 : 14)

ONLY Jehovah God ALONE Is The SAVIOUR!

( Isaiah 43 : 3, 11, 45 : 15, 21; Hosea 13 : 4; Luke 1 : 47)

( 1 Timothy 1 : 1, 2 : 3, 4 : 10; Titus 1 : 3, 2 : 10, 3 : 4; Jude 1 : 25)

Therefore, JESUS CHRIST Is God!

12) JESUS CHRIST Forgave sins! ( Matthew 9 : 2; Mark 2 : 5)

ONLY GOD Can Forgive sins! ( Mark 2 : 7)

Pure And Holy SCRIPTURE Teaches us ( Titus 2 : 13):

JESUS CHRIST Is The Great God, The

Only Saviour Who Can Forgive sin!!

If we Deny HIS Deity, how can HE FORGIVEus our sins?

After all, It isOnlyGod's OWNBLOOD( Acts 20 : 28 KJB!),

That Has Power To "CLEANSE us From ALL sin!" Amen?

to be continued...

Just 1 verse that Jesus said he is God please .

We must confess Jesus , so why would not he confess that he is God if he is God .

Jesus never lies .

God never lies .

God hundreds of times openly said I Am GOD .

Go and prove Jesus said I AM God . It does not exist in the Bible .

What does exist Jesus saying that he is the Son of God , and that God sent him and he came from God .

But he never said I AM God ! Why ? It would have been a lie .

The Jews killed Jesus for saying he was the Son of God , not saying He was God , did you read that ? You should . I hope this helps true seekers .

Bonnie Another point I wanted to make was that whats known as The Trinity or Holy Trinity is God , Jesus Christ and The Holy Spirit being the exact same entity. That started at the creed of nicea during Emperor Constantines Rulership and was adopted as doctrine. I personally don't see that scripturally but again people get excited about this.

Because it's a different gospel and a different God and savior , not biblical , it's catholic.

Precious friend, Bonnie, yes The LORD JESUS CHRIST Is God Almighty, With God His Father, And, With The Holy Spirit. They Are "THREE Who Are ONE!" ( 1 John 5:7)

More Scriptural Confirmation:

Is The Holy Spirit God?: According To The Pure And Holy Scriptures!:

(A) The Holy Spirit Is The God That "Ananias And Sapphira lied to!"

( Acts 5 : 3-4 KJB!).

(B) The Holy Spirit IS The God That Raised JESUS CHRIST From The Dead!,

( Romans 8 : 9-11 cp 1 Corinthians 6 : 14; 2 Corinthians 4 : 14; 1 Peter 3 : 18)

(C) The Holy Spirit IS The Omnipresent God That Dwells IN All "believers,"

Being The "Blessed Teacher!," For: Understanding!

( Romans 8 : 9-11 cp 1 Corinthians 3 : 16, 6 : 19, 2 : 13!)

Is JESUS CHRIST The Almighty God?What Saith The

PureAnd Holy Written WORD Of God, The SCRIPTURES?

The First 13 { of 150+ } SCRIPTURAL "Reasons" {Evidence!}

JESUS CHRIST Is Almighty God:

1) God Was Manifest In The Flesh! ( 1 Timothy 3 : 16)

JESUS CHRIST Was Manifest In The Flesh! ( John 1 : 14)

2) JESUS CHRIST Is EMMANUEL

"interpreted = God With us!" ( Matthew 1 : 21-23)

3) The SON, JESUS CHRIST Is Called

God, By HIS Own Father! ( Hebrews 1 : 8)

4) JESUS CHRIST Is Called

The Great God And Saviour! ( Titus 2 : 13)

5) JESUS CHRIST Is Called

The Mighty God! ( Isaiah 9 : 6 cp Jeremiah 32 : 18)

6) JESUS CHRIST Is Called

The True God And Eternal Life! ( 1 John 5 : 20)

7) JESUS CHRIST Is Over All, God,

Blessed For Ever. Amen! ( Romans 9 : 5)

8) ALLthe angels of God Worship HIM!

( Hebrews 1 : 6), therefore, It IsImpossible

for JESUS CHRISTto be = "Michael the archANGEL!"

Therefore, All The Evidence In The Pure And Holy WORD Of God

Plainly And Clearly Teaches Allhumble students That:

JESUS CHRIST Is God Almighty! Amen?

to be continued...

Bonnie Are you asking if there the exact same being, I don't see that scripturally but that one is a hot debate, the reason I don't see it Jesus christ right now is sitting at the right hand of Gods throne, the scripture say God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself, but like I said there's two sides to that.

Excellent point David , God was in Christ , this is truth , that does not make Jesus God by any means . All people that are born again God is in , that does not make them God either .

If there is no comment to this that will explain everything I need to know. I saw your list but that I already know it doesn't explain what's being ask.

First, there is no way we can dispute the divinity of Jesus Christ, He is the only begotten Son of God, His name is above every name that is named. The trinity doctrine is in most main denominations of churches and is the foundation of Christianity and is in their Statement of Faith. I have been told I am not a Christian if I do not believe in the trinity doctrine because I do not understand who God is.

Is the definition of Christianity the belief and the following of Jesus or the belief in a triune God?

Does this doctrine give man the authority to override what scripture says about how we are saved?

Would God be behind a doctrine that is responsible for thousands plus thousands of Christian deaths?

Do we deny Jesus by saying He is God? 1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. (The Father AND the Son)

Does not scripture show a literal Father and Son and the Son does the will of the Father?

What do we do to the meaning of this scripture, do we make it not true, by saying Jesus is God? John.3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Is salvation dependent on the belief of this doctrine, if so why was it not taught in scripture?

Does the trinity doctrine confuse and convolute our understanding that is far from the simplicity of Christ and a complete reversal from all the foundations set in the Old Testament?

Is the trinity doctrine a burden placed on us like the Pharisees sect tried to do with circumcision as in Acts 15?

Every word of Jesus was of the Father, every will of Jesus was the will of the Father, Jesus was equal to God on this earth because He was the word of God manifested to do the will of the Father with all the authority of the Father. A word is not a word before it is spoken, and that word is who spoke it.

Just questions,

RLW

Thank you for that excellent post R.L.W. You put things into words much better than me , much love in Christ .