Carl, the issue of 'why Christians suffer' is one of the biggest dilemmas we often see amongst believers.
My thoughts are these.
First of all, it helps to remember that all of our maladies stem from the fact that we ourselves our sinners, albeit redeemed ones, and live in a fallen world. This is not heaven; believers are subject to anything and everything this world holds.
Secondly, because we have sinned, and there is much work yet to do within our hearts to conform us to God, the Lord does bring us through many difficulties, whether financial distress, relational troubles, and physical ailment, to name a few. Many of God's saints have been exercised in sickness of mind and/or body, as well as manifold other troubles! David says, in Psalm 119:67, 'Before I was afflicted, I went astray; but NOW I have kept Thy Word." Afflictions are the sheepdogs that drive us to our Shepherd. :) And I smiled wryly at one point of your comment, Carl: "...she is faithful to the church". That can be a wonderful thing! What an honor to serve the lambs of Jesus! Amen! BUT, often, we can slip into being more faithful to the church than we are to Jesus Himself. We spend our time in programs and other things that actually eat up time that He wants us to spend with Him. I'm not saying this is the case with this dear woman...but it could be that Jesus is 'making her to lie down' on her back for a while so that she looks up at Him more. :)
ALL things work together for good to those who are the called according to His purpose". Romans 8:28.
2 Cor. 4:
16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;
God designs that all that we experience in this life draws us closer to Him. May we all learn to let all things we endure cast us deeper into the mold of Christ Jesus! Amen!
Eph.4:26 is not about anger against our brothers in the Lord or people in general, Be Angry, and sin not, it is against the devil
we are to be angry and don't let up on him, don't allow him to accuse you and bring you into fear and doubt the power of God.
Christians should make a stand and don't let their anger against the devil to stop, John 10;10, the devil is out to kill, steal and
destroy YOU so stop being passive! You have been given power and authority Luke 10:19, AMP read it- its time for the church to wakeup -your enemy is not the people - but the devil that's behind them. Corinthian 2:16, "You have the mind of Christ," Romans 8:11, " the same spirit that raised Christ from the dead is in you declare it 2Peter 1:3, 'His divine power has given us everything we need for a Godly life. This verse is not about you be angry all day but at sun set you can not be angry against your wife , your children your neighbor, your Mother or Father but be vigilant against the devil Jesus did it Matthew 16:23, Jesus turned and to Peter " Get behind me Satan", then sweet Jesus in John 2:13-16, goes after the money changers - amazing. So think again Ephesians 4:26, Blessings David
Praise be to God for the salvation of your family members! I will be praying for you and your family, may you all be united through the love of Christ. I hope these verses will encourage you and remind you to keep going strong for the Lord.
Romans 8:37
"Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us."
1 Corinthians 1:10
"Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."
Thanks for that Suze. I agree with much that you wrote, but rather than deal with each part of it, I would ask, What is the origin of our carnal minds? What was in Paul's mind when he stated, "the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God" Romans 8:7,8: where does this carnal mind/carnal life, lived in the flesh, come from?
Is this something God has given us from our birth, or has another intruded into humanity causing us to sin against God & that sin has been passed on to all generations? ( Romans 5:12; Acts 5:3; 1 Timothy 5:14,15; 2 Corinthians 2:10,11; 1 Thessalonians 2:18; Luke 22:31,32; etc., are a few verses showing Satan's activity, from the first day till the day he is put away, & our ongoing struggle to withstand him & his devices & to live in the power & joy of the Holy Spirit).
Satan is never absent - He is present - He is at work - and working in the hearts & minds of those who choose to live according to the dictates of their flesh & not in the fullness of the Spirit. Such were the gross sins of those kings mentioned earlier - if Ananias & Sapphira could have Satan gripping their heart so as to lie to the Spirit, how much more of Satan's control over those kings & indeed so many rulers/govts of today & their workings against Jesus Christ.
Marke, there are a lot of different directions I can go with this, but, I am going to keep this rather short and simple. If predestination was the intended by God, then that would make Him a "respecter of persons" ( Rom. 2:11), which he is not. Christ came to save the entire world from sin ( John 3:17). Jesus even said what whosoever believes on him would be saved ( John 3:15-16). That is anyone. We also see in the Greek that this believe is present and on-going faith. Not a 1x event that secures the believer and preserves them.
When God is speaking about foreknowledge and predestination He is not speaking of individual salvation, but, His plan of salvation. For example, in Romans 9 when talking about Jacob and Esau he is not talking about God loving Jacob the person and hating Esau the person. He is talking about the 2 nations, Israel and the Edomites. He knew from the foundation of the world that there would be a fall and mankind would need a Savior, as he is Omniscient.
So, God does not predestine some to Heaven, while overlooking others so they can go to hell. God hates all sin and wants all to repent and come to His Son for salvation. It is His will that ALL be saved ( 1 Tim. 2:4). However, we must accept receive this gift and allow with Holy Spirit to work in our hearts. remaining faithful is not one trying to "keep themselves saved". It is responding to the gift of the Holy Spirit written on their hearts.
Very well said Doug! Context matters even in the Greek. And I don't think the KJV writers got it wrong when with all the if/then conditional verses. Salvation is contingent on remaining faithful to the end! God has made it clear we have a choice. His spirit is there to guide us and help us grow but the bible doesnt say anything about us never being able to resist it. Matter of fact we warned not to quench it. As Rev. 2: 10 says, be faithful until death and receive the crown of life. Can't be any more clear than that! If salvation was unconditional it we would see it in the bible and dont think I need to go looking in the Greek to see what God is saying in plain English.
You said "Just curious to know if you are faithful to Christ, and if so, what causes you to be faithful?" and the answer is clearly the Holy Spirit. However, we need to look deeper into scripture and what the exact function of the Holy Spirit is and what our obligation is in our relationship with Christ for final salvation.
Before salvation, the Holy Spirit of God works and draws us to the Father and to accept His Son's sacrifice for salvation. However, we have a free will and can resist this. Since it is the will of the Father that all be saved, but know that many won't because they will reject Christ, we must conclude that there is a free choice on the part of the one who the Holy Spirit is working on and drawing to Christ. We even is in John 3:16 "whosoever believeth" is a reference to anyone. It is not the "elect" as John Calvin taught.
We see that once one receives the Holy Spirit they must continue believing. We see in John 3:16 that "believeth" is present continual. If salvation was a 1 time event then "believeth" would be in the "Aorist". Yet, every time we see believeth it's in the continuous tense.
Just as the Holy Spirit draws us to the God, we make the choice to receive it. This is not forced on us. From there, God works in the us to do His will and good pleasure. So, remaining faithful is NOT a "work" but a response to the grace of God working in our hearts. However, scripture is clear that we must endure in faith to receive the inheritance of eternal life. Notice John 10:29 says "they", not "he". This is a blessing for believers as a whole. The individual still has to endure in in the Christ's body.
John 15 illustrates what I'm talking about. V. 5 says if a man abide not (aorist) he is cut off. It's the exact moment of leaving the protective hand of God ( John 10:29) he is cut off. However the one that abideth (present continual) remains in Christ and in the Father ( 1 Jn 2:24-25).
I agree with you that a believer has an obligation to remain faithful to the Lord. In fact, that's what the Lord expects from us, faithfulness. He is faithful to us and He expects the same in return. But what is it that causes a believer to remain faithful? Is it our flesh, our human effort? Or is it the Spirit of Christ dwelling in a believer that causes them to remain faithful?
Just curious to know if you are faithful to Christ, and if so, what causes you to be faithful?
I do not generally judge a person's true spiritual condition, especially early in their profession. I did not have assurance I was really saved for several years after I got saved. I encourage new believers to follow on to grow in Christ and to give diligence to make their calling and election sure by continually taking heed to God's word.
Allow me to use the parable of the sower in Matt 13 to answer your question. The three types of hearers who did not get saved never showed signs of a new life in Christ like the good hearer did. The fake Christians did not bring forth good fruit to perfection and the fake Christians did not come unto a good understanding of God's word like the good hearer did.
19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
I noticed you distinguish between real and fake Christians. What is your definition of a real Christian?
If non-believer attends church tomorrow and responds to an altar call professesing faith in Jesus do you consider that person a real Christian or is there a particular test that determines which they are?
Cod chose Christians in Christ before they were born but His selection was based upon His foreknowledge, not according to some plan He had that did not involve the response of the sinner to the preaching of the Gospel. We have been chosen in Christ since the beginning if we are saved. If it were possible for Christians to lose their salvation it nevertheless remains impossible for God to have chosen them in Christ from the beginning.
Erich did an excellent job using scripture to interpret scripture. However, you appear to just be saying you're right, but there's still no biblical support. You're saying that John 10:28 is absolute based on your rational, but, not grounded in scriptures. You're saying everyone just needs to believe John 10:28 is a OSAS verse, even though that is not even what Christ was intending. He was admonishing the Jewish leaders who refused to come to the light. Yet, you did not address the fact the John 10:27 is also ABSOLUTE and only the one following Jesus is safe in the hand of God.
Having to remain in the Son to remain in the Father for eternal life ( 1 John 2:24-25) doesn't negate the promise that all who are being saved are in the Father's hand. You said "We are ALL bought with a price, we are NOT our own...He paid for us with his own blood". If this is the case, why is not everyone just automatically saved? After all, Christ's atoning death was for the whole world. And if one genuinely accepts Christ & then renounces him, why would that person still have eternal life & the one who never accepted Christ lost? After all, they both ended up denying Jesus ( Matt. 10:32-33).
It seems like you're taking bible verses regarding Christ's one time sacrifice for the entire world and trying to apply that to individual believers. Yes, Christ shed his blood once for all, but, that does not mean the believer doesn't have an obligation to remain faithful. Rev. 2:10 says " be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." This is a conditional promise from Christ, so I must conclude that the one who is safe in the hand of God is the one who is remaining faithful to Christ. And the one faithful to the end will receive the end of their faith, eternal life ( Romans 6:22; 1 Peter 1:9)
Christians are assured of salvation & should take great joy in the promise of God to keep them in His hand! However, to inherit eternal life one must endure to the end.
I got saved in 1971 just before I joined the Army. I ended up in a church with one of my supervisors at Ft. Gragg and we became close friends for more than two years. But in 1974 my friend and I had a disagreement over a Bible teaching and he accused me of possibly having committed blasphemy against the Holy Spirit for which I would never be forgiven. This bothered me a great deal so I began praying for God to show me what the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost was all about. After seeking the answer for several years I believe the Lord finally answered me. Here is what I believe:
God has promised to enlighten every sinner born into the world ( 1 John 1:9). The Holy Spirit seeks to save every sinner in the world ( 1 Tim 2:4.) The Holy Spirit draws all men to Christ ( John 12:32.) The sin of blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is committed by sinners who see the light, are pointed to Jesus by the Holy Spirit, and yet reject the light and speak evil of Jesus, the Holy Spirit, or God. ( John 3:19.) The basis of condemnation to hell is rejecting the light clearly revealed to the unrepentant sinner by the Holy Ghost.
We see that in Romans 1 where sinners who clearly see and understand the light reject the light and are therefore condemned without excuse. The Pharisees who blasphemed the Holy Spirit in Mark 3 knew Jesus was God because Nicodemus said so in John 3:2. We know sinners who have not yet been shown the light by the Holy Spirit can be guilty of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit because of what Jesus said in John 15:22-24.
As I thought upon your post, I got thinking about 2 verses. The first is Romans 8:7 -
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
This is our condition before being born again. We are 'at war' with God; our sinful nature rebels against God, and the apostle tells us we, in that state, CANNOT obey God's law, and in honesty - we do not want to obey God's law! We want our own wills to be done!
This is why Jesus said we must be born again, we must be 'born from above', at which time we receive a new heart, a heart of flesh.
The next verse I thought of is:
Hebrews 8:10 -
For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Once those laws are written within, we suddenly LOVE God's law and delight in both knowing it and doing it! .And we delight in it because we are no longer at enmity with God, but because we love Him!
You are so right, Michele, in observing that in obeying God's Word and making that the rule of our lives, we not only please God - we keep ourselves from being entangled in this fallen world!
Thanks for the question. Giving it some thought, I defer to what Jesus said, blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, as the unforgivable sin, but it is not clearly defined in His words. But I think that 1 Peter 2:1 speaks of this concerning those who are false teachers among the believers who bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. So, denying the Lord, which is apostasy, is this blasphemy against the testimony of the Holy Spirit concerning Jesus, His Person and work of saving atonement. I may be wrong on this. It may be helpful to read the whole chapter in 1 Peter.
Reply to GiGi. If we can sin a sin after we are saved that will result in God's withdrawal of His promise to never leave us or forsake us what would that sin be?
Glory to our Father, the King of all Gods and to our Lord and saviour Christ Jesus.
To be plucked from the Fathers hand, you must first be in His hand. Many will come and many will see and put their trust in the LORD....this is the born again to see, as told to Nicodemus in John 3. Yet many are called but few are chosen.... This is the born again to be entered in.
For the many drop away, as we are shown they are corrupt soil. The Word came to them, but they did not keep His Word, so they could not deny self, they never saw the cross, nor did they follow. They worked iniquity! They walked in flesh and self.
Flesh is made from dust, and dust is land.....soil.
These were never born again to be entered in,
These never saw the kingdom of GOD,
These were born again to see only and never received the Spirit to walk in.
Is why seek Ye FIRST the kingdom of GOD and his righteousness, IS FIRST!
Always, seeking our Lord is First, in all thy ways, in every thing, at all times, day and night, at morning and noon and evening, without ceasing, from the rising of the sun unto the going down of the same the LORDS name is to be praised.
In 1 Corinthians 13 , this is born again to be entered in.
We know and are known, the glass before us clears , we see clearly through the glass.
And looking unto JESUS, the author and finisher of our faith who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of GOD.
always always always, eyes on JESUS , must look at what you seek to find it .
There are two audiences the Word speaks to,
The born again to see, which is flesh.....and the born again to be entered in, which is Spirit.
When I became a man I put childish things away , The Word of GOD is quick and powerful , the Word of GOD endures forever, the word of GOD does not return to Him void.
For He is great and doeth wondrous things, He is Lord alone, teach us thy ways o LORD
Our Spirits talk at each other. I know you are blessed by God. I enjoyed all verses you gave, every word in those chapters spoke clearly to me. All things work together for good for those who truly love God. Thank you my fellow bride in Christ. My prayers have been answered.
Grace to you and peace from our God, The Father in Heaven and The Lord Jesus Christ.
"And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose." Romans 8:28 KJV
Erich...Thanks for your response...But John 10 : 29 is not a scripture that can be negotiated or twisted ...Its Absolute...Jesus is saying My Father that gave them me is GREATER then all and No man is able to pluck them from my Fathers hands...Period...And about the parable of the sower that good seed is the living WORDS the very seeds of God...Thats y he is saying to whom the WORD came it made them Gods and the scripture cannot be broken Jesus's breath/words...Which means you donot understand the ENORMITY of the seed of the sower...Remember NO MAN can pluck them out of my fathers hands.
.....Thats y we cannot fallaway even if we wanted to...That good seed is the very seed of God..Spirit and Life,..We are ALL bought with a price, we are NOT our own...He paid for us with his own blood...If i be lifted up i will DRAW ALL men unto me when the time comes...( when the book is opened in Gods right hand ) Thats when the Kingdom comes..That woman in birth pains
.....That good seed is his WORD and his Word cannot return unto him void...It has to accomplish what it was sent to do a Birth a baby Christ which is the H.G that Child of Promise...Ya gotta realize that the sower of this good seed is the bridegoom..Thats y he has to KNOW us thats when the good seed is sown in our hearts...Thats hearing his voice ( his seed ) Hebrew 11 : 1 impling Faith and Real Faith is a spritual pregnancy simply b/c its the substance of things hoped for ( a baby Christ )...The H.G. The evidence of things NOT seen...Simply b/c the Child is spirit..Whosoever receiveth one such child in my name receiveth me..She brough forth a man child a baby that is gona rule all nations and her Child was caught up to God and to his throne..Remember the babes and sucklings...His children that gonna result from his seed...They don't call him the bridegroom for nothin..ok leme go Gbu Erich
Hi Sarah. The Jewish Sabbath starts from the evening of the Friday according to our Gregorian calendar. They keep to the same dates as we have them, except that their year is different (their current year is 5782). So whether your calendar shows Sunday as the first day of the week or Monday as the first, it won't matter, as the Sabbath will always start from Friday evening. And all their other holidays & observances are based on the calendar we have.
As the Jew remains under the Law, it is imperative that they abide to the given Law, for by it they will be judged ( Romans 2:12). But for the one In Christ, our judgement was at the Cross & the Law has no hold or gives any penalty to us ( Romans 8:1-4).
I do not believe Christ saves a sinner but then makes that salvation dependent on that sinner keeping himself pure enough from sin not to warrant being rejected by Jesus in the end.
I believe foolish virgins with no oil in their lamps, professing Christians with no fruit of the Holy Spirit and no works to evidence genuine faith, and foolish hearers who build their houses on the sand are all pictures of sinners who never get saved because God saw they valued other things more than God, like the eager young man in Matthew 19 who valued his money more than salvation.
I do not believe we are running a race with the end goal of obtaining salvation in the end for scoring well on the run. Christians are immediately saved as soon as the Holy Spirit fills them in response to their whole-hearted search for forgiveness and salvation on the basis of Jesus' death on the cross.
My thoughts are these.
First of all, it helps to remember that all of our maladies stem from the fact that we ourselves our sinners, albeit redeemed ones, and live in a fallen world. This is not heaven; believers are subject to anything and everything this world holds.
Secondly, because we have sinned, and there is much work yet to do within our hearts to conform us to God, the Lord does bring us through many difficulties, whether financial distress, relational troubles, and physical ailment, to name a few. Many of God's saints have been exercised in sickness of mind and/or body, as well as manifold other troubles! David says, in Psalm 119:67, 'Before I was afflicted, I went astray; but NOW I have kept Thy Word." Afflictions are the sheepdogs that drive us to our Shepherd. :) And I smiled wryly at one point of your comment, Carl: "...she is faithful to the church". That can be a wonderful thing! What an honor to serve the lambs of Jesus! Amen! BUT, often, we can slip into being more faithful to the church than we are to Jesus Himself. We spend our time in programs and other things that actually eat up time that He wants us to spend with Him. I'm not saying this is the case with this dear woman...but it could be that Jesus is 'making her to lie down' on her back for a while so that she looks up at Him more. :)
ALL things work together for good to those who are the called according to His purpose". Romans 8:28.
2 Cor. 4:
16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;
God designs that all that we experience in this life draws us closer to Him. May we all learn to let all things we endure cast us deeper into the mold of Christ Jesus! Amen!
Blessings, Carl....
Repent= the act of leaving what GOD prohibited & returning to what HE commanded.
Revelation 2:5, Matthew 3:2, Luke 13:3-9, Exodus 20:14,
Where does it say to be sorry, because of our trespass?
Remember the woman: John 8:1-12, Psalms 130:4,
James 2, Matthew 25:31-46, Ezekiel 33:11,
Luke 9:23, Matthew 16:24, Mark 8:34, Romans 8:13, Matthew 10:28, Colossians 1:10-23, Ephesians 5:1-20, Jude 1:24-25,
Hopefully these are helpful
we are to be angry and don't let up on him, don't allow him to accuse you and bring you into fear and doubt the power of God.
Christians should make a stand and don't let their anger against the devil to stop, John 10;10, the devil is out to kill, steal and
destroy YOU so stop being passive! You have been given power and authority Luke 10:19, AMP read it- its time for the church to wakeup -your enemy is not the people - but the devil that's behind them. Corinthian 2:16, "You have the mind of Christ," Romans 8:11, " the same spirit that raised Christ from the dead is in you declare it 2Peter 1:3, 'His divine power has given us everything we need for a Godly life. This verse is not about you be angry all day but at sun set you can not be angry against your wife , your children your neighbor, your Mother or Father but be vigilant against the devil Jesus did it Matthew 16:23, Jesus turned and to Peter " Get behind me Satan", then sweet Jesus in John 2:13-16, goes after the money changers - amazing. So think again Ephesians 4:26, Blessings David
Romans 8:37
"Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us."
1 Corinthians 1:10
"Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."
Matthew 10:34, Romans 8:38-39, Ecclesiastes 3:1-11,
Genesis 3:24, 1Chronicles 21, 1Chronicles 24:16, Exodus 32:27, read in context Exodus 32, Leviticus 26, Numbers 22, Deuteronomy 13:15, Deuteronomy 20:13, Deuteronomy 32, Jeremiah 50:35-37, Amos 1:11, Amos 9:4-15,
Joshua 5:10-15 continues Joshua 6,
1Samuel 15,
2Kings 6, note 2Kings 6:22, 2Chronicles 23:21, Nehemiah 4, Esther 9, Jeremiah 43:11, Hosea 2:18, Micah 4:3,
Hope these encourage
Is this something God has given us from our birth, or has another intruded into humanity causing us to sin against God & that sin has been passed on to all generations? ( Romans 5:12; Acts 5:3; 1 Timothy 5:14,15; 2 Corinthians 2:10,11; 1 Thessalonians 2:18; Luke 22:31,32; etc., are a few verses showing Satan's activity, from the first day till the day he is put away, & our ongoing struggle to withstand him & his devices & to live in the power & joy of the Holy Spirit).
Satan is never absent - He is present - He is at work - and working in the hearts & minds of those who choose to live according to the dictates of their flesh & not in the fullness of the Spirit. Such were the gross sins of those kings mentioned earlier - if Ananias & Sapphira could have Satan gripping their heart so as to lie to the Spirit, how much more of Satan's control over those kings & indeed so many rulers/govts of today & their workings against Jesus Christ.
When God is speaking about foreknowledge and predestination He is not speaking of individual salvation, but, His plan of salvation. For example, in Romans 9 when talking about Jacob and Esau he is not talking about God loving Jacob the person and hating Esau the person. He is talking about the 2 nations, Israel and the Edomites. He knew from the foundation of the world that there would be a fall and mankind would need a Savior, as he is Omniscient.
So, God does not predestine some to Heaven, while overlooking others so they can go to hell. God hates all sin and wants all to repent and come to His Son for salvation. It is His will that ALL be saved ( 1 Tim. 2:4). However, we must accept receive this gift and allow with Holy Spirit to work in our hearts. remaining faithful is not one trying to "keep themselves saved". It is responding to the gift of the Holy Spirit written on their hearts.
Before salvation, the Holy Spirit of God works and draws us to the Father and to accept His Son's sacrifice for salvation. However, we have a free will and can resist this. Since it is the will of the Father that all be saved, but know that many won't because they will reject Christ, we must conclude that there is a free choice on the part of the one who the Holy Spirit is working on and drawing to Christ. We even is in John 3:16 "whosoever believeth" is a reference to anyone. It is not the "elect" as John Calvin taught.
We see that once one receives the Holy Spirit they must continue believing. We see in John 3:16 that "believeth" is present continual. If salvation was a 1 time event then "believeth" would be in the "Aorist". Yet, every time we see believeth it's in the continuous tense.
Just as the Holy Spirit draws us to the God, we make the choice to receive it. This is not forced on us. From there, God works in the us to do His will and good pleasure. So, remaining faithful is NOT a "work" but a response to the grace of God working in our hearts. However, scripture is clear that we must endure in faith to receive the inheritance of eternal life. Notice John 10:29 says "they", not "he". This is a blessing for believers as a whole. The individual still has to endure in in the Christ's body.
John 15 illustrates what I'm talking about. V. 5 says if a man abide not (aorist) he is cut off. It's the exact moment of leaving the protective hand of God ( John 10:29) he is cut off. However the one that abideth (present continual) remains in Christ and in the Father ( 1 Jn 2:24-25).
I agree with you that a believer has an obligation to remain faithful to the Lord. In fact, that's what the Lord expects from us, faithfulness. He is faithful to us and He expects the same in return. But what is it that causes a believer to remain faithful? Is it our flesh, our human effort? Or is it the Spirit of Christ dwelling in a believer that causes them to remain faithful?
Just curious to know if you are faithful to Christ, and if so, what causes you to be faithful?
I do not generally judge a person's true spiritual condition, especially early in their profession. I did not have assurance I was really saved for several years after I got saved. I encourage new believers to follow on to grow in Christ and to give diligence to make their calling and election sure by continually taking heed to God's word.
Your response suggests that you can determine a Christian by fruit, but a new Christian has no fruit track record yet.
So, if someone hears the gospel for the first time tomorrow and decides to be a Christian, at that time is he a 'real Christian' to you?
Allow me to use the parable of the sower in Matt 13 to answer your question. The three types of hearers who did not get saved never showed signs of a new life in Christ like the good hearer did. The fake Christians did not bring forth good fruit to perfection and the fake Christians did not come unto a good understanding of God's word like the good hearer did.
19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
I noticed you distinguish between real and fake Christians. What is your definition of a real Christian?
If non-believer attends church tomorrow and responds to an altar call professesing faith in Jesus do you consider that person a real Christian or is there a particular test that determines which they are?
God bless.
Cod chose Christians in Christ before they were born but His selection was based upon His foreknowledge, not according to some plan He had that did not involve the response of the sinner to the preaching of the Gospel. We have been chosen in Christ since the beginning if we are saved. If it were possible for Christians to lose their salvation it nevertheless remains impossible for God to have chosen them in Christ from the beginning.
Having to remain in the Son to remain in the Father for eternal life ( 1 John 2:24-25) doesn't negate the promise that all who are being saved are in the Father's hand. You said "We are ALL bought with a price, we are NOT our own...He paid for us with his own blood". If this is the case, why is not everyone just automatically saved? After all, Christ's atoning death was for the whole world. And if one genuinely accepts Christ & then renounces him, why would that person still have eternal life & the one who never accepted Christ lost? After all, they both ended up denying Jesus ( Matt. 10:32-33).
It seems like you're taking bible verses regarding Christ's one time sacrifice for the entire world and trying to apply that to individual believers. Yes, Christ shed his blood once for all, but, that does not mean the believer doesn't have an obligation to remain faithful. Rev. 2:10 says " be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." This is a conditional promise from Christ, so I must conclude that the one who is safe in the hand of God is the one who is remaining faithful to Christ. And the one faithful to the end will receive the end of their faith, eternal life ( Romans 6:22; 1 Peter 1:9)
Christians are assured of salvation & should take great joy in the promise of God to keep them in His hand! However, to inherit eternal life one must endure to the end.
I got saved in 1971 just before I joined the Army. I ended up in a church with one of my supervisors at Ft. Gragg and we became close friends for more than two years. But in 1974 my friend and I had a disagreement over a Bible teaching and he accused me of possibly having committed blasphemy against the Holy Spirit for which I would never be forgiven. This bothered me a great deal so I began praying for God to show me what the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost was all about. After seeking the answer for several years I believe the Lord finally answered me. Here is what I believe:
God has promised to enlighten every sinner born into the world ( 1 John 1:9). The Holy Spirit seeks to save every sinner in the world ( 1 Tim 2:4.) The Holy Spirit draws all men to Christ ( John 12:32.) The sin of blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is committed by sinners who see the light, are pointed to Jesus by the Holy Spirit, and yet reject the light and speak evil of Jesus, the Holy Spirit, or God. ( John 3:19.) The basis of condemnation to hell is rejecting the light clearly revealed to the unrepentant sinner by the Holy Ghost.
We see that in Romans 1 where sinners who clearly see and understand the light reject the light and are therefore condemned without excuse. The Pharisees who blasphemed the Holy Spirit in Mark 3 knew Jesus was God because Nicodemus said so in John 3:2. We know sinners who have not yet been shown the light by the Holy Spirit can be guilty of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit because of what Jesus said in John 15:22-24.
As I thought upon your post, I got thinking about 2 verses. The first is Romans 8:7 -
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
This is our condition before being born again. We are 'at war' with God; our sinful nature rebels against God, and the apostle tells us we, in that state, CANNOT obey God's law, and in honesty - we do not want to obey God's law! We want our own wills to be done!
This is why Jesus said we must be born again, we must be 'born from above', at which time we receive a new heart, a heart of flesh.
The next verse I thought of is:
Hebrews 8:10 -
For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Once those laws are written within, we suddenly LOVE God's law and delight in both knowing it and doing it! .And we delight in it because we are no longer at enmity with God, but because we love Him!
You are so right, Michele, in observing that in obeying God's Word and making that the rule of our lives, we not only please God - we keep ourselves from being entangled in this fallen world!
Blessings!
Thanks for the question. Giving it some thought, I defer to what Jesus said, blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, as the unforgivable sin, but it is not clearly defined in His words. But I think that 1 Peter 2:1 speaks of this concerning those who are false teachers among the believers who bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. So, denying the Lord, which is apostasy, is this blasphemy against the testimony of the Holy Spirit concerning Jesus, His Person and work of saving atonement. I may be wrong on this. It may be helpful to read the whole chapter in 1 Peter.
We are saved, are being saved, and will be saved if we endure until the end in Christ.
To be plucked from the Fathers hand, you must first be in His hand. Many will come and many will see and put their trust in the LORD....this is the born again to see, as told to Nicodemus in John 3. Yet many are called but few are chosen.... This is the born again to be entered in.
For the many drop away, as we are shown they are corrupt soil. The Word came to them, but they did not keep His Word, so they could not deny self, they never saw the cross, nor did they follow. They worked iniquity! They walked in flesh and self.
Flesh is made from dust, and dust is land.....soil.
These were never born again to be entered in,
These never saw the kingdom of GOD,
These were born again to see only and never received the Spirit to walk in.
Is why seek Ye FIRST the kingdom of GOD and his righteousness, IS FIRST!
Always, seeking our Lord is First, in all thy ways, in every thing, at all times, day and night, at morning and noon and evening, without ceasing, from the rising of the sun unto the going down of the same the LORDS name is to be praised.
In 1 Corinthians 13 , this is born again to be entered in.
We know and are known, the glass before us clears , we see clearly through the glass.
And looking unto JESUS, the author and finisher of our faith who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of GOD.
always always always, eyes on JESUS , must look at what you seek to find it .
There are two audiences the Word speaks to,
The born again to see, which is flesh.....and the born again to be entered in, which is Spirit.
When I became a man I put childish things away , The Word of GOD is quick and powerful , the Word of GOD endures forever, the word of GOD does not return to Him void.
For He is great and doeth wondrous things, He is Lord alone, teach us thy ways o LORD
Grace to you and peace from our God, The Father in Heaven and The Lord Jesus Christ.
"And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose." Romans 8:28 KJV
.....Thats y we cannot fallaway even if we wanted to...That good seed is the very seed of God..Spirit and Life,..We are ALL bought with a price, we are NOT our own...He paid for us with his own blood...If i be lifted up i will DRAW ALL men unto me when the time comes...( when the book is opened in Gods right hand ) Thats when the Kingdom comes..That woman in birth pains
.....That good seed is his WORD and his Word cannot return unto him void...It has to accomplish what it was sent to do a Birth a baby Christ which is the H.G that Child of Promise...Ya gotta realize that the sower of this good seed is the bridegoom..Thats y he has to KNOW us thats when the good seed is sown in our hearts...Thats hearing his voice ( his seed ) Hebrew 11 : 1 impling Faith and Real Faith is a spritual pregnancy simply b/c its the substance of things hoped for ( a baby Christ )...The H.G. The evidence of things NOT seen...Simply b/c the Child is spirit..Whosoever receiveth one such child in my name receiveth me..She brough forth a man child a baby that is gona rule all nations and her Child was caught up to God and to his throne..Remember the babes and sucklings...His children that gonna result from his seed...They don't call him the bridegroom for nothin..ok leme go Gbu Erich
As the Jew remains under the Law, it is imperative that they abide to the given Law, for by it they will be judged ( Romans 2:12). But for the one In Christ, our judgement was at the Cross & the Law has no hold or gives any penalty to us ( Romans 8:1-4).
I believe foolish virgins with no oil in their lamps, professing Christians with no fruit of the Holy Spirit and no works to evidence genuine faith, and foolish hearers who build their houses on the sand are all pictures of sinners who never get saved because God saw they valued other things more than God, like the eager young man in Matthew 19 who valued his money more than salvation.