23Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
24But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
25And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
Further insight. As Ephesians 1:6 states we are to be made acceptable in the beloved. As far as us "accepting" Christ; that is not Biblical as James 2:19 warns about God. Christ is more than Savior; He is Lord and Master; whether we acknowledge it or not there are only two alternatives ( Matthew 21:44). His Sheep hear His voice; the goats do not. ( John 10:27).
This "committing" of men it would seem would involve the Godhead living within someone and being sealed with the Spirit. It would involve chastising which Hebrews 12:8 in King James brings out pretty strongly in regard to those not in Christ who are "bastards."
Therefore Jesus had to do constant "weeding" out; and this would involve challenging statements; parables; and other means.
Jesus in Luke 16:15 warned that what was esteemed or honorable among men was an abomination to God. That is different than what Jesus Himself did when He was praised in Luke 2:52 for His growth in wisdom and stature in terms of how He "gained favor" at that time. That shows His humility in the 30 or so years; taking up the majority of His earthly life being submissive to His parents (unlike the Pharisees who found ways through their religious piety to disrespect parents for the sake of their own material gain).
Jesus loved His own so much that He made sure that He was the atoning sacrifice on the cross through His own volition; and death could not hold Him. (see John 10:18). It was a miracle in itself that He survived all the attempts on His life (including Gethsemene) through supernatural assistance so that He could make it to the cross to die at the set time and place. No one in scripture is said to be amazed at these acts
Think about the evidence Christ presented that He was indeed the Messiah. Indeed; supernatural blindness HAD to be given; for Jesus even told people to believe Him even for the sake of His works ( John 14:11). And the verse was indicative of His being part of the Godhead. There were HUGE numbers of people being miraculously fed at least twice; people healed of blindness which had NEVER occurred even with the Old Testament miracles ( John 10:21); people who had demons cast out of them; as well as the miracles entrusted to the 12 Apostles and the 70 sent out two by two ( Luke 10:11). There was the undeniable proof of natural phenomenon at the crucifixion ( Matt. 27:54); as well as the 500 witnesses that saw Him; including the Apostles AFTER He was Resurrected and they all died except for John as martyrs; clearly they knew and believed the truth since denial would have saved their lives.
Unbelief therefore is something learned. Children are all born into sin; but scripture makes it clear that they have angels beholding the Father continually and that they were drawn to Christ (see Matt. 18:10). Children came to Christ ( Mark 10:13-16) and praised Him as a fulfillment of Psalm 8:2 and mentioned by the Lord in Matthew 21:16. To deny the obvious requires a hardness of heart and soul; and deliberate rejection of known truths; which of course made the condemnation of the Pharisees greater than most; and was much of the reason Jesus excoriated them in nearly the entirety of Matthew 23. They knew the prophecies but were blinded because of their obsession on the law and all other traditions that were added to put men in bondage and to render mercy and justice meaningless ( Matthew 23:23) with their myopic tunnel vision. The rest of the world if NOT enlightened by the Spirit only looked at Christ as some great miracle worker but didn't worship Him as God in the flesh.
Hence Matthew 16:17 must occur for true salvation.
I would say that there are two functions of scripture; which come from it's record. Strictly speaking; we have the Old Testament (some say the New Testament concealed); and the New (which some say is the Old Testament revealed). It is the account given
through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit ( 2 Tim. 3:16) which is useful for teaching; instruction in righteousness; etc. It contains
eternal truths as to the past; present and future state of man's soul as well as the environment which will exist (eventually a new heaven and earth for those saved; and the lake of fire for those whose names are NOT in the Book of Life. ( Rev. 20:15).
The functions; therefore would be a declaration of a future for those saved; to whom have been called and chosen and who have
heard His voice ( John 10:27); and for others who have not ( John 3:18) who are judged by their works and have rejected Christ
to save them from their unregenerate state.
John 16:8 shows that the function of the Holy Spirit is to reprove the world in relation to sin; righteousness and judgment.
The writings and copies of texts are so accurate that if one LETTER was off on the count of the Pentateuch (first five texts of
the Bible) it would be destroyed and started again. This also demonstrates certain patterns in scripture which I won't venture
into here; but the Bible of course is also useful for history; lessons of sins to avoid; and every other instruction manual on practical wisdom for our lives and has different forms that are poetic; prophetic; acrostic; and intersect personal lives with larger themes seemlessly. Therefore there are many applications which the Bible can be beneficial for (even as a learning tool for a given language before it was kicked out of the schools).
For it has been granted to you not only to believe in Christ but also to suffer for him (Phillipians 1:29). Acts 5:41 is in a similar vein; namely being thankful for being worthy to be persecuted in His name; which is promised for all true believers. ( 2 Tim. 3:12; etal). The promise of being chastised if we are a true child of God and other sufferings aren't exactly the first thing we focus on
when it comes to God's promises. But of course if we consider these hard sayings first; we can learn to appreciate the more pleasurable promises in a greater way.
The opposite is true of course; in light of Hebrews 11:25. Sin runs its course of earthly pleasures; which lead up to eternal condemnation. For God's children; however there are pleasures evermore in His right hand ( Psalm 16:11). The fullness of life is also mentioned in that verse which corresponds with John 10:10 in living life to the full. Food and clothing are promised in the Gospels ( Matt. 6:25); (compare with 1 Kings 17:6 where the ravens brought Elijah food). Notice that shelter or a place to rest His head is mentioned as lacking in Matthew 8:20; which made some turn away from following Him. Surely Christ Himself did stay in peoples' homes for short interludes; but He also spent many nights on mountains in prayer; or sleeping on a boat.
Much prayer; of course seems to be edifying when focused on fulfilling the Great Commission. God states in Isaiah 55:11; that His word will not go out void; but accomplish His purposes. If we are doing His work; then we can be sure to reap what we sow; in terms of reward (see Psalm 126:5). Heavenly treasures are a promise for those who are serving out of a pure heart (see 2 Timothy 4:7-8). Therefore; the end ouf our sufferings in Christ will bring eternal glory that outweighs anything on earth. (see Romans 8:18). 2 Corinthians 4:17-18 also discusses "momentary afflictions" that don't compare to heavenly bliss.
Good question: Why wd this woman keep the commandments when she has the testimony of Jesus.
First, the testimony of JESUS is the Spirit of prophecy. She is clothed with the Sun, the Greater Light , sent in the fourth Day or around 4000 years after Adam, that is JESUS. JESUS said:My Father worketh hitherto, and I work- John 5:17KJV. I and my Father are One- John 10:30. Under her feet the Lesser light, the Holy Spirit, also sent in the fourth Day, gives her sustention / sustenance, furthermore, the woman is already crowned under the doctrine of the twelve Apostles chosen by our Lord JESUS.
Yes, the dragon (the man of sin, son of perdition, the Beast of the earth- Revelation 13:11 combined with 2Thes. 2) was (will be) wroth/wrath with the woman, he will persecute the woman which brought forth the MAN child -the ancient of days - the Lesser Light - and to the woman is given two wings of a great eagle -the OT and the NT -, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished - nourished by the OT and NT, the commandments and testimony of JESUS -, for a time, and times, and half a time (42 months), from the face of the serpent- Revelation 12:14KJV.
And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. And the earth(earth here is the clay- Isaiah 64:8, the dry land) helped the woman(will be 144K???), and the earth(Jewish believers) opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon (a strong DELUSION that will be sent by GOD-2Thes.2:11-12 combined with Revelation 13:11-18) cast out of his mouth.
Let us get ready, it is midnight, the bridegroom comes; let us go out to meet Him, all of us need to arise and trimmed our lamps. But wait, only lamp is not enough to walk now, it's necessary / essential to have oil, otherwise, the lamp will go out, but at midnight? in full darkness and nocturnal terrors?
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. This speaks on a person present condition once he heareth Christ word, and believeth on him that sent him,
To be able to hear the word is a condition.
This is the blood tipped ear mentioned in scripture and also what's meant in John 10:27-28.
These verses along with many of what have been shared by others suggest that you are saved now not later.
However, just say if we are wrong, how do we stand in the day of judgement?
God is a righteous Judge and requires perfection. No one can present that!
If we're to be judged, what sins is he going to pardon?
How many times can we get away with sinning before we're condemned?
What role did the cross play in our salvation?
Why didn't he just stick with the old sacrificial systems if the blood of Christ couldn't take away sins?
These are valid questions if we are to be judged with the dead.
James 1:15 illustrates the process of sin leading eventually to death. Thus; Adam began to die in all ways once he sinned; spiritually immediately as Ezekiel 18:20 indicates it affects the soul and the death in the body continues until eventually we return back to the dust we came from. Hence; there was immediate estrangement from God when Adam and Eve hid; and God pronounced the resulting curse in childbirth; tilling the earth is sweat with thistles and thorns; etc.
We must also understand that there are those predestined to be in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world ( Ephesians 1:3-6). The opposite is true for the unregenerate as seen in Revelation 17:8. Christ's death was therefore part of a plan from before Creation where all those would hear His voice who were His sheep ( John 10:27). We must remember that His death was effective from what happened in time and space 2000 years ago. It also is retroactive; as it were in order to allow those who were of old to eventually in time and space have access to heaven (see Romans 6:9). Therefore; at the Rapture ( 1 Thess. 4:15) shall involve the Resurrection of all souls of deceased saints; followed by bodily ascension of those alive and remaining. There are some verses which seem to indicate O.T. saints may arise later on in say the Midpoint of the Tribulation or near the end; there is some debate on that question. Some already apparently were resurrected ( Matt. 27:52-56). This would have been a gleaning of the firstfruits; so to speak.
My point here is predestination and the fact that God initiates repentance ( Acts 11:18); etc. There is such a thing as godly repentance and worldly ( 2 Cor. 7:10); illustrated by that of Peter and Judas Iscariot. Genuine repentance brings life and brings sorrow at offending a Holy God; worldly sorrow only is interested in consequences of our actions; and in Judas' case he only recognized Christ as having "innocent blood"; not as God's Son to be worshipped.
Sorry Jema but the Lord says follow me and he was not passive and often rebuked when necessary.
I don't see anywhere in scripture as you say it.
Jesus and his disciples were very direct and didn't turn to the left or right.
In Revelation he warns us of this spiritual fornication and Lukewarmness.
You mentioned Love.
Jesus displays his love for the sheep in John 10. He gives us an example of one who don't love the sheep in John 10:12-13.
These warnings and protection from the wolf is an act of love for the sheep.
Is it considered aggressive when you put so much focus on me and try to muffle me from speaking whar is true concerning this matter and taking little indirect shots on other matters?
Yes I expose their agenda when I feel someone new to the site may need a little more info to understand the direction this person is headed.
It puzzles me when you continue to step in every time I speak on this, but this group I'm referring to never denies the accusations.
Where were you when I was under attack a few months ago for not wanting to engage in a ongoing eschatology thread?
Hi Jimbob. You wrote well though if I could just highlight the 'apostasy' (apostasia), as seen in 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & consider what the Apostle Paul was speaking of here. I realize that it would be simple to understand his statement as applying to believers, before that day of Christ's coming, that some would apostatize by rejecting Christ going back into the world or to embrace another religion. But are we correct to believe that this was what Paul was speaking of in light of his other writings & that of our Lord? (refs. John 10:27-29; John 6:37; 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:13,14; Ephesians 4:30; Romans 8:28-30; Jude 1:24,25; 2 Corinthians 5:17; 2 Timothy 2:19).
When we look at the definition of 'apostasy', it is as you have given ("An abandonment of what one has professed, a total desertion, or departure from one's faith, a total abandonment of the Christian faith"). But 'apostasy' is not simply restricted to a 'total departure from one's faith' but also 'a total departure or abandonment of one's principles, party, cause' (and one could even add 'departure from the Word of God which lays out the principles and Truths of doctrine & righteous living').
Unfortunately, the 2 Thessalonians 2:2-5 passage is not explicit to show us how Paul was applying this 'apostasy'. Obviously, the Thessalonian believers probably knew much more than we have been given (v5 'remember...I told you these things?'). Clearly, this apostasy doesn't relate to principles or causes of the world, because its context shows that Paul is speaking of an apostasy that will affect believers in some way. The question then is: is it the rejection of Christ altogether, or a departure/rejection of the Truth of God's Word? But isn't that the same thing, one could ask? I think you will agree Jimbob, that this rejection of Truth & promotion of unbiblical interpretations & lifestyle, has been going on for a long time - from within the Church itself.
-Please pray for understand for God will give him who ask freely.
It's written in John 10:35 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 35, If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
meaning the bible cannot contradict itself. infact Jesus Has Said this in Proverbs 8:8 All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; There is nothing froward or perverse in them.
So, my advice to you is to Kneel down and repent of your unbelief and ask The Lord Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God to Help you understand His words The sharp two- Eged sword.
In Matthew 6:22 -23. 22Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
-What we fail to see here is this, Satan entered unto peter and he is using peter to try and deceive Jesus Christ not to Go to the Cross and if The Lord Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God would have not gone to the cross then the whole bible would be compromised, and every word of prophecy would collapse just by that one action. remember Just before Jesus was arrested by the temple Gurds/solders What He said unto them. in Matthew 27:53-54
53Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? 54But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?
According to Genesis 4:15; a mark set upon Cain was to cause vengeance to anyone who would attempt to take his life. Compare this to the Mark of the Beast in Revelation 13 and we find some interesting parallels.
First; Satan was a "murderer from the beginning." ( John 8:44). It is no surprise that the first child of Adam was to be attacked after Adam and Eve fell. Having failed the test of God he let temptation rule over him and slayed Abel his brother. Satan is also said to steal and destroy ( John 10:10) along with his lying. We see the progeny of Adam and Eve being destroyed; along with stealing from the parents being able to give an inheritance and Abel receiving it.
Later on in Genesis 4:24 Lamech tries to gain vengeance by his declaration of seventy times seventy for himself for his own violent actions. Kind of like the opposite of forgiveness for the same in Matthew 18:21-22.
The apparent resurrection of Antichrist from a deadly wound as well as being able to kill the two prophets that tormented men will inspire him to declare indestructibility as well as being able to effectively fight against God. He will likely convince men that he can live forever by merging with AI; and likely the DNA of the Nephilim or something to that affect will be part of that plan; as it was in Genesis 6 when all the descendants of men were destroyed for that reason (see Genesis 6:8-9 on Noah being perfect in his generations). Hence at that time we saw no repentance except for Noah; his wife; his 3 sons and their wives.
Whatever the case men will be unredeemable once they take the mark ( Revelation 14:9 and other passages). That will be the fulfillment of 2 Thessalonians 2:11 where people willingly reject the truth and believe The Lie.
The verse on those who dwell on the earth ( Revelation 11:10; also see Revelation 6:10 and other passages) indicates the sea of lost humanity. Revelation 13:8 concludes this for all unsaved.
Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, MANY BELIEVED IN HIS NAME, ( when they saw the miracles which he did.)
BUT JESUS DID NOT COMMIT HIMSELF UNTO THEM, because he knew all men,
And needed not that any should testify of man: FOR HE KNEW WHAT WAS IN MAN.
( MANY BELIEVED IN HIS NAME,)
( BUT JESUS DID NOT COMMIT HIMSELF UNTO THEM.)
( FOR HE KNEW WHAT WAS IN MAN.)
This group that believed on his name, Could we call these his sheep?
John 6:64-66.
But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
( From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.)
"Were these his sheep"?
I believe we all agree these in Matthew 7:23 are not his sheep.
How about this group?
Are they his sheep?
"They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 1 John 2:19.
They're all sheep!
Turning back and getting lost is their nature!
It's what sheep do!
But Christ is the great shepherd and he has his own sheep!
What is the role of the shepherd?
What is the capability of the great shepherd?
Answer; John 10:27-28. "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
AND I GIVE UNTO THEM ETERNAL LIFE; AND THEY SHALL NEVER PERISH, NEITHER SHALL ANY MAN PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY HAND.
It is vital; at this stage to reiterate that we must repent of unconfessed sin. God has designed it so that if we are not willing to do this there is great torment that can render us powerless in our walk. That is a warning to all those "confessions" of blessings "declared" on ourselves or others; it in reality brings a curse on us. The reason why is because we are in a Covenant with the Lord and therefore it is His end of the deal to not only save His people but sanctify us; "purging out the dross" ( Isaiah 1:25).
Part of the problem is that for some bizarre reason it seems to me that very few Christians shall we say overestimate Satan's threat to our well being. It seems strange since a die hard individual on the other camp doesn't seem to have too much difficulty believing in that reality; and occasionally is driven to faith in the Lord when one of his "bargains" with the enemy goes awry (his true colors are exposed). At face value; someone who seeks to kill; steal and destroy ( John 10:10) would be considered an enemy. Sometimes I think we take the love your enemies verse and twist it around; perhaps not to have sympathy for the devil; but to somehow dumb down how evil he is (probably in part because it makes our own comfortable lives in jeopardy realizing that reality). Since he is the power of the air as it were leading men astray; it should be held in conjunction with the fact that man is apart from Christ unable to do any good or as the Reformers state in "total depravity."
If we would focus on the cause rather than the effects of endless problems we see with our natural eyes in this fallen world
we may be able to live out a better walk with the Lord in our prayer lives.
Fear of death ( Hebrews 2:14-15) is something which I have struggled with; I know better but that is one of the enemies' favorite torments. God will deliver His people; but let us be diligent in prayer for ourselves and others as 1 Peter 5:9 says
Introduction to the concept of eternal assurance; "once saved always saved".
I have seen currently individuals who are knowledgeable in the Word and who seem to love the Lord who argue that we can lose our salvation. I don't feel comfortable fellowshipping where that is the standard doctrine; although the conviction level for holiness seems commendable to me. Nonetheless; the enemy an cause havoc for those who would be in despair and perhaps self destructive over that type of message. Equally as concerning are those who are allowing certain sins; particularly those who support a lifestyle of sin in the church today holding onto what many call a "hyper grace" mentality. First and foremost; of course we are to test ourselves to see if we are in the faith and DO something about it if not. ( 2 Cor. 13:5). Those who are His; of course willl hear His voice ( John 10:16) and be taught by God ( John 6:45).
Blessed assurance is something which must transcend this world; and our love for God supersede any other affections and loyalties for us to be a true disciple of God ( Matt. 10:37-38). If we love Him we will obey His commandments ( John 14:15); this is a verse I have repeated quite often lately on this site.
I would make a basic comment at present that those who are His sense His love; and also recognize that when being chastised ( Hebrews 12:6). When the Spirit is grieved ( Eph 4:30-31) a true follower of Christ will be aware of it; after all He has made His (actually OUR) abode in these individuals ( John 14:23). It is also true that those who are unbelievers cannot love God but they certainly can fear Him. In today's society; however it is likely that such boldness in rebellion in the world is tied into the lack of fear of the Lord in churches. The compromised Gospel and lifestyles today I will tackle in future posts.
The book of John is something I have already covered sometime last year in detail as to the many examples proving Predestination.
John 10:18 shows us that Christ had the power to give up and take life back again. Starting at the statement at His death "it is finished" ( John 19:30) the atonement was complete at the same moment. The comment from the fellow prisoner (the one who repented) at the cross recieved a response just prior to that event where Christ assured him "today you shall be with me in paradise" ( Luke 23:43). This shows that sheol which at the time was the abode of all the dead (see state of Lazarus vs the rich man in the parable of Luke 16:19-31). Jesus came to set the captives free ( Ephesians 4:7-10) also alluded to in several other passages that could also refer to those captive in sin still on earth. He preached to the spirits in prison ( 1 Peter 3:19) which were either the demons or Nephilim and their offspring which were in the abyss before their time; or all the lost. Those who were His own were set free; their souls went to heaven and many appeared after His Resurrection ( Matt. 27:52-53). Thus; after this time only wicked in the torment part of hell still exist down there.
Christ; of course was the "first of the firstfruits" ( 1 Cor. 15:20). There will be the following afterwards; those who came out of their graves at that time as I stated above; then those at His appearing (i.e. Rapture); then those at His coming (2nd Coming). The firstfruits continue until the 144,000 which is a sort of gleaning of Israel ahead of the main harvest the countless multitude coming out of the Great Tribulation. ( Rev. 7:9).
What is most sobering is that Christ still bears marks on His body ( Luke 24:39); apparently the only one who is resurrected with such scars reminding us of his earthly suffering and existance. Hence; God did not allow His holy one to remain in sheol or see decay ( Psalm 16:10). He was the perfect; unblemished Lamb of God who we shall forever worship and adore.
If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Jesus saith unto him, HAVE I BEEN SO LONG TIME WITH YOU, AND YET HAST THOU NOT KNOWN ME, PHILIP? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
1 Corinthians 15:28.
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, THAT GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL.
This is after the Millennium reign, Then he will establish the eternal reign.
Then he will return to his place where he was in the beginning,
( back to the God head)
"That God may be all in all"
Who raised Christ from the dead?
John 10:17-18.
Romans 8:11.
Act 13:30.
Answer; The triune God. "Elohm".
If Jesus is the body of the Father but yet a separate God as one claims. That contradicts what is written in scripture.
Ephesians 4:4-6.
"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all."
We're servants and worshipers of that one God. Now and for ever.
Hi Donna. I care little about your real name; it's the message one conveys that is important to me & particularly so to those who have little or limited knowledge of the Word.
In respect to Psalm 82, this has been much quoted over the past months, even years, & I have during that time shared my understanding, so I'll mention it briefly here. But I would first ask, what is Psalm 82 speaking about - I mean the whole Psalm & not just lifting out a verse & making it mean something?
From verse 1 to verse 8, the message is the indictment of unjust wicked judges (earthly judges). And when we come to an interesting phrase in verse 6, "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High", one should immediately look to the original language of this verse & the context of the Psalm, only because if we don't do so, then any interpretation one gives might be correct.
But the word used here for "gods" is 'elohim'; and this word is a generic word, which is used of the True God, of gods, of rulers, of judges. Given the message in Psalm 82, 'elohim' certainly can't apply to the True God (which I believe you won't subscribe to either), neither to other gods or an imitation of the true, but to the judges spoken of in the Psalm. And Jesus used this verse in John 10:34, which they would have understood in entirety: that God spoke of judges, and as judges & men, they were "children of the most High". If then Jesus said, "I am the Son of God", why should these accusatory Jewish leaders accuse Jesus for claiming to also be a Son of God? And then Jesus spoke on His relationship to God by the works that He did. But those judges of Psalm 82 were wicked "and would die like men", and these too, to whom Jesus spoke, were of that ilk: judging Jesus wrongly & would stand before their Judge, the Judge of the whole Earth ( Psalm 82:8).
So, I hope you can see Donna, that we cannot use this Psalm to teach that we all become gods nor change any other Scripture to suit us.
We also know from Scripture that no one can keep himself saved. John teaches, in 1 John 5:18 (as recorded in the oldest Greek manuscripts), "We know that everyone who has been born from God does not practice sin; but the one who has been born from God, God is keeping him and the evil one does not touch him."
John also states in John 10:27-29, "My sheep hear my voice and I know them; and they follow me. And I give to them eternal life; and they will never perish forever and not anyone will seize them from out of my hand. My Father who has given them to me is greater than all, and no one is able to seize them from out of the hand of my Father."
Jude states in his doxology in verse 24, "But to the one being able to keep you without stumbling and to set you before His glory blameless in exultation."
Paul in his writings emphasized the keeping power of God's Spirit in Ephesians 1:13-14: "In whom also after having heard the Word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, in whom also, after having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is the guarantee of our inheritance, for redemption of the possession, for the praise of His glory."
He states again in Ephesians 4:30, "And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God in whom you were sealed for the day of redemption." Probably one of the most powerful Scriptures of God's keeping power is Romans 8:38-39: "For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor powers, nor any thing which has come, nor things coming, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."
The only way a person can be saved is by a spiritual birth from God; and the only way a person can keep his salvation is through the keeping power of God.
I'd like to share some verses I've been noticing lately during my readings in regards to once saved always saved or not. Some verses appear to support it so I see why people believe this, but is that really what it means?
John 10:28 - neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
What about followers who voluntarily left His hand?
Luke 15:4-7 - Jesus gives the parable of the lost sheep. But the sheep is still a follower. If the sheep denounced its Shepherd and left the herd to become a wolf, Jesus doesn't say He goes to rescue wolves but just the sheep in His flock. Verse 7 also adds a condition- "if" the sheep repents. People often skip that part. Maybe it's uncomfortable for some to humble themselves to genuinely repent and ask for forgiveness to God. I think this is what Jesus expects. It doesn't say the Christian can follow the world, sin as much as he wants, abort babies, use profanity, cheat, lie, steal, kill, abuse the body with drugs, and fill with lust, and not repent, not follow Jesus and be 100% fine. I see no verse saying that is all is fine if done intentionally. Seems like doing that is like spitting in Jesus's face and mocking what He did for us.
Heb 6:1 talks about repentance. Heb 6:6 says those who have "fallen away" can be brought back through repentance. If it wasn't possible for Christians to fall away then why does the Bible say that Christians can fall away? It says its a disgrace, like crucifying Jesus all over again.
Heb 5:13 says that some Christians are still living on milk like an infant and still not pursuing righteousness. Some in this forum have claimed that effort to be righteous is "bad" and apparently doing evil is good? That of course is from satan.
Heb 5:2 talks about Christians who have gone astray or "out of the way" of the path. If it were not possible to veer off the path of following Jesus then why does the Bible warn us not to do that?
Heb 4:1 warns Christians to not fall short of God's "rest".
We have a basic exhortation as a people to be the "head" instead of the "tail" (see Deut. 28:13). As a church; we should be willing to support the brethren especially when we can see trouble coming as we see in Acts 2:45 similar to what was predicted by Agabus in Acts 11:28. Wisdom is something the Lord will give us if we ask ( James 1:5). That may apply currently to extracting finances or money from risky investments or bank accounts to have some on hand; to have emergency food supplies and a generator at hand; precious metals for trade; etc.
Our political leaders are not to be worshipped either (I am leaving names out here). There is enough at fault in both sides of the political spectrum. Whether it is possible at this point for anyone of integrity to lead our nation and for that person to win the party nomination (again no names here) is something I am not placing any bets on. Proverbs 16:18 warns us that pride comes before a fall; and certainly there is enough of that to go around. People hear what they want to hear; but those of the house of the living God will hear His voice ( John 10:27). When we hold on to this life too much; we forget that we are "seated in heavenly places" ( Eph. 2:6). That is a present state; but our future hope in glory is brought forth by natural death or martyrdom. I am convinced that we would never see the harvest of innumerable saints ( Rev. 7:9) if the 5th seal event and later killings of the Antichrist for not taking the Mark were not instituted. Apparently; "tribulum" means a threshing board using in harvest for separation purposes. Satan will be used as God's instrument to finally bring the wheat to fruition in the heat of the fires of that trial ( Rev. 3:10). As for now we should heed to the admonition of the very next verse as rewards can and will be lost for those who don't remain patient and are distracted by things of this world today. May we keep our eyes on Him.
Psalms 82:6 I (Christ) have SAID, Ye are gods, the children of the most high.
Jesus himself QUOTED his OWN prophecy.
John 10:35 If HE (the spirit of prophecy) CALLED them (the children of resurrection) gods, unto whom the WORD OF GOD CAME, and the scripture CAN NOT be BROKEN.
Jesus is telling the Pharisees, they read and study the scriptures, but have no knowledge of their TRUE MEANING, very little has changed TODAY.
John 1:5 And the light shineth into darkness, and the darkness comprehended it not.
You say Psalms 82:6 means gods of this world, antichrist, sons of predition
Let's see what happens to this scripture when we apply it to mean as you define it.
I (Christ) have SAID, ye are gods (antichrist, sons of perdition, Satan, gods of this world), THE CHILDREN OF THE MOST HIGH.
Let's apply your definition to some other scriptures.
Deuteronomy 10:7 For the Lord your God is a God of gods (sons of perdition, gods of this world, antichrist)
Joshua 22:22 The Lord God of gods (gods of this world, sons of perdition, antichrist), the Lord God of gods ...
I hope you rethink what you are saying about GOD'S WORDS.
Could it possibly be your not rightly dividing God's Word, maybe Paul was talking about something completely opposite to what Christ was Prophesying.
My rebuttal is ALSO in LOVE.
Does the church you attend preach the KINGDOM of God, or is it like most churches and preaches heaven and hell?
It looks like the thread you addressed me on has been closed t further comment. So, I will respond with a new thread.
I am happy to bring Scriptures to this conversation. But before I do, please answer me yes or no: Are you Earl Bowman?
If you do not answer this question of mine with a yes or a no, then I will know that you are a deceiver.
As to your inquiry about Psalm 82:1-6 and Jesus' usage of this Psalm in John 10:35. The context of this verse in psalms is a reference to the judges of Israel that were appointed to make judgements for the people when they had a legal matter to bring forward to resolve.
God, in this Psalm is rebuking these judges (and any leader) because they judged sinfully. They favored those who oppressed and did wickedly and would not defend or uphold the cause of the widows, orphans, and poor, but instead made judgments against these who needed right judgements and mercy. God does not speak of them favorably in this psalm.
It does say that "ye are gods" and the meaning of this is not that they are truly gods, but those who sit in the place of the only true God when they pass their judgments. Therefore, the only True God expects them to judge with justice and righteouosness, but they did not. They judged sinfully, therefore, this iniquity proves that they are not truly gods.
The Bible speaks of gods as referring to those that pagans worship. Are these gods truly gods since Scripture calls them such?
Exodus 12:12 says that God will bring judgment on all the gods of Egypt. Are these gods real or idols/false gods?
Exodus 23:13 God says to not invoke the names of their (Israelites) other gods. Were these other gods truly gods or were they false gods/idols?
Joshua 24:14 God instructs Joshua to tell the Israelites to throw away the gods of their fathers. Were these gods truly gods or were they false gods/idols?
I could list many more Scriptures where God speaks of other gods, but it is clear they are not gods. Jer. 2:11 ...
Psalms 17:15 As for ME (Christ), I will behold thy (the Father and God of Christ) face: I (Christ) will be satisfied, when I (Christ) awake (am resurrected, by the Father's SPIRIT), with THY (the Father's) likeness.
Romans 6:5 For if were be planted TOGETHER (you and Christ) in the likeness of his (Christ) DEATH; we shall also be the LIKENESS of HIS RESURRECTION.
Genesis 5:1 In that DAY (the day of the LORD; ALL MEN died with Christ and all MEN were resurrected with Christ) that God created man ( BY the resurrection), in the LIKENESS of GOD created he them.
Psalms 104:30 Thou sendest forth THY (the Father of ALL ( Ephesians 4:6) SPIRIT, THEY (all men) are CREATED; thou renewest the face of the earth.
Ezekiel 1:5 And out if the MIDST thereof (Christ) there came forth four LIVING CREATIONS, And this was their appearance, they (the new creation) had the appearance of A MAN (Christ).
Ezekiel 10:10 And as for the for their appearances (the LIVING CREATIONS), they four (the new creation) had ONE LIKENESS, as a WHEEL (Christ) in the MIDST of a WHEEL (Christ).
Colossians 1:27 ..this MYSTERY (of his resurrection) ... CHRIST IN YOU ..
Romans 8:28 For whom he (the Father of ALL) did foreknow, He (the Father) did predistinate (by the resurrection of Christ) to be conformed to the IMAGE (God) of his son, that he (Christ) might be the FIRSTBORN among many (cloned by his resurrection) BRETHREN.
Psalms 82:6 For I (the Father) have said, YE (my new creation, by your brother's resurrection) ARE GODS, the children of the most high.
John 10:35 If he (our Father, the WORD) called them (the new creation, by resurrection) GODS, unto WHOM the word of GOD CAME ( Hebrews 9:28), the scripture CANNOT be BROKEN.
Luke 20:36 Neither can THEY (the new creation) DIED ANYMORE (you died with Christ on the cross): for they are EQUAL to the ANGELS ( Isaiah 63:9...and the ANGEL of HIS (Christ in YOU) PRESENCE SAVED THEM.
No No... Gi -Gi...love ya But Remember Jesus said that there will only be 1 shepherd and 1 sheepfold not 2.... John 10:17....Remember Jesus told ic.a jew he had to be bornagin....Christ has to be born in us Jew or gentile...Thats y he always refers to himself as the son of man.... 1 Cor. 12:13....By 1 spirit are we all baptised into the body of Christ... Jew or Gentile,..Bond or Free...male or female.
Thou will not leave my soul in hell nor suffer thy holy 1 to see corruption....But Peter said this is just prophetic of Christ
You will not go to hell if you trust God and what He has done for you. You see, God the Father sent his begotten Son who is Jesus Christ (also known as the Word) into the world so that he can receive it back. Jesus Christ was the lamb that was slain for the sins of mankind, which includes you and me; so that God's justice and God's wrath could be fulfilled. Jesus Christ lived a sinless life and knew no sin, but still became sin for us because in such a way God loves the world, so that he himself will receive punishment instead of us. Now that Jesus Christ is risen and proclaimed Lord according to his resurrection, it is known that he has victory over death and that all who believe in him will appear like him. If you believe that He died for your sins and shed His blood for your forgiveness, you are saved and adopted into God's family by the sealing of the Holy Spirit.
In this dispensation, known as the Church Age, it was revealed to Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles, for it was the mystery that was not revealed to others beforehand. The Church is the body of Christ placed to be a light to the world until the day of the Lord; which is God's wrath during the seven year tribulation and his second part of the second coming at the battle of Armageddon.
God has placed every believer in his body, just as he is the head of the body, and every member is like its members, and he will never forsake them. This means that all those who believe today and are saved will never be forsaken, as Jesus himself said in John 10:28; "And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."
In this way, you can be sure that if you have put your trust in Christ alone and in the work of salvation performed on Calvary's cross with His blood, you are saved and you will never perish.
Thank you David0920 for sharing that. I think we will have to part from each other on this matter. As much as I can understand & appreciate what you've given as the right way to approach the Bible, I still maintain that there is still a fundamental mind-set & approach we must have before we even first open those sacred pages. If we throw out those essential rules, then we can do or interpret anything we want, to God's Word, all under the guise of being Spirit-led & inspired. I know that the Spirit can & will do all that is necessary to guide us into all Truth, but how many are actually believing what the Spirit reveals & how their own perceptions & coloring of the Scripture assures them of the 'truth', their 'truth'.
An example that comes to mind: Psalm 82:6 states, "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." And Jesus refers to it in John 10:34, "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?" The answer? 'from those Scriptures, all God's children are also gods'. I doubt if you believe that. Rather, using the basic tools first, will help us understand what is meant.
Even for example, the Bible translators, had to be firmly grounded on a set of established rules & patterns of their work before they could even begin (& the same goes for those in Bible translation today, working amongst various people groups). If the basic laws are not adhered to, I wonder what sort of mess the work of Bible translation (& even expository deliveries) would find themselves in. And by the way, I see no difference in those translating the Bible from original texts to those of us who have the Bible in our hands & read it with both understanding & discernment of the Truths within. We need those rules so as to rightly divide the Word. The Holy Spirit will then take us into a deeper understanding & application of those Truths, which makes the Bible more than a record of historical events, which is so to many casual readers.
For the believer, Jesus is our hope ( 1 Timothy 1:1), He is our peace ( Ephesians 2:14), He is the light of the world ( John 8:12), He is the good shepherd who gave His life for His sheep (All those who have surrendered their life to Him ( John 10:11), He is the head of the church ( Ephesians 1:22), He is the only one who sets us free from our sin ( John 8:36), He is our redeemer ( Job 19:25), He is the only atoning sacrifice for our sin ( 1 John 4:10), He is the Savior of those who receive Him ( Luke 2:11, John 1:12), He is the creator of all things ( Colossians 1:16-17, John 1:1-3), He is the word of God, and He is God ( John 1:1, Isaiah 9:6), He is our only way to salvation ( John 10:9, John 14:6).
There are many, many more descriptors in the Bible that tell us who Jesus is, but it would take many more posts to list them all.
They could be basing their claim on any one of the following pieces of scripture:
John 1:1, John 1:14, John 8:24, John 8:58, John 10:30-33, John 20:28, Hebrews 1:8, Colossians 2:9, Philippians 2:5-8, Psalm 45:6.
The Bible tells us that we are to worship God alone, and yet Jesus received worship and never rebuked anyone who worshipped Him. We see evidence of this in Matthew 2:2, Matthew 2:11, Matthew 14:33, Matthew 28:9, John 9:35-38, Hebrews 1:6.
Isaiah 44:6 reads, "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: "I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God besides me."
In Rev 1:17, it says "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as a dead man." In Daniel 10:8-9, Daniel did the same thing. When he saw this vision of Christ, he fell down as he was dead. In Ezekiel 1:28, Ezekiel sees the vision and he falls down as a dead man. It goes on to say "Fear not; I am the first and the last: (the designation of God, found in Isaiah 41:4, and Isaiah 48:12).
In Revelation 1:18, it says I am He that lives, and this is another designation of God found in Psalm 84:2, and Joshua 3:10.
I am He that lives. God presents Himself to the Jews as the living God. He says I am He that lives, and was dead; literally, and became dead, and behold, I am living forevermore, His resurrection, His eternalness.
And then it reads, Amen; and I have the keys of hell and of death. Keys are a symbol of authority. Those who were in charge of the temple had the keys to the temple. We are told later on that the Lord (Jesus) will be in control of hell and death.
In Matthew 16:15, Jesus asks His disciples who do you say I am? Peter had the perfect answer. Peter said "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God."
Peter was Jewish. The phrase "Son of the living God" from a Hebrew standpoint is a phrase used for God. To a Jew, claiming to be the Son of God was considered blasphemy, but that was Peter's response to who Jesus was
There are different religions extant which teach that Godhood is a graduated experience (God was once man) and that man can actually attain the level of Godhood. The number of religions which teach this is increasing as more polytheistic, Eastern religions are being introduced to America. Joseph Smith (founder of Mormonism) taught the following:
"God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted Man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens...I say, if you were to see him to-day, you would see him like a man in form -- like yourselves, in all the person, image, and very form as a man....it is necessary that we should understand the character and being of God, and how he came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity, I will refute that idea, and will take away and do away the veil, so that you may see....and that he was once a man like us; yea, that God himself the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth the same as Jesus Christ himself did." (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3).
Verses used to teach man can become God. The apostle Peter wrote of being "partakers of the divine nature" ( 2 Pet. 1: 4). A careful study of the text reveals the apostle is teaching that we are to acquire traits of God, such as "godliness," "virtue,", etc. (vs. 5-11). Indeed, we are to be Godlike and partake of the divine nature in this sense. Jesus used the word god in an accommodative sense in John 10: 34, 35. "God," as used in John 10 and Psalms 82: 6, is applied to superior people, rulers. Jesus, however, is not teaching that these rulers had become God as God is God.
24But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
25And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
Further insight. As Ephesians 1:6 states we are to be made acceptable in the beloved. As far as us "accepting" Christ; that is not Biblical as James 2:19 warns about God. Christ is more than Savior; He is Lord and Master; whether we acknowledge it or not there are only two alternatives ( Matthew 21:44). His Sheep hear His voice; the goats do not. ( John 10:27).
This "committing" of men it would seem would involve the Godhead living within someone and being sealed with the Spirit. It would involve chastising which Hebrews 12:8 in King James brings out pretty strongly in regard to those not in Christ who are "bastards."
Therefore Jesus had to do constant "weeding" out; and this would involve challenging statements; parables; and other means.
Jesus in Luke 16:15 warned that what was esteemed or honorable among men was an abomination to God. That is different than what Jesus Himself did when He was praised in Luke 2:52 for His growth in wisdom and stature in terms of how He "gained favor" at that time. That shows His humility in the 30 or so years; taking up the majority of His earthly life being submissive to His parents (unlike the Pharisees who found ways through their religious piety to disrespect parents for the sake of their own material gain).
Jesus loved His own so much that He made sure that He was the atoning sacrifice on the cross through His own volition; and death could not hold Him. (see John 10:18). It was a miracle in itself that He survived all the attempts on His life (including Gethsemene) through supernatural assistance so that He could make it to the cross to die at the set time and place. No one in scripture is said to be amazed at these acts
Think about the evidence Christ presented that He was indeed the Messiah. Indeed; supernatural blindness HAD to be given; for Jesus even told people to believe Him even for the sake of His works ( John 14:11). And the verse was indicative of His being part of the Godhead. There were HUGE numbers of people being miraculously fed at least twice; people healed of blindness which had NEVER occurred even with the Old Testament miracles ( John 10:21); people who had demons cast out of them; as well as the miracles entrusted to the 12 Apostles and the 70 sent out two by two ( Luke 10:11). There was the undeniable proof of natural phenomenon at the crucifixion ( Matt. 27:54); as well as the 500 witnesses that saw Him; including the Apostles AFTER He was Resurrected and they all died except for John as martyrs; clearly they knew and believed the truth since denial would have saved their lives.
Unbelief therefore is something learned. Children are all born into sin; but scripture makes it clear that they have angels beholding the Father continually and that they were drawn to Christ (see Matt. 18:10). Children came to Christ ( Mark 10:13-16) and praised Him as a fulfillment of Psalm 8:2 and mentioned by the Lord in Matthew 21:16. To deny the obvious requires a hardness of heart and soul; and deliberate rejection of known truths; which of course made the condemnation of the Pharisees greater than most; and was much of the reason Jesus excoriated them in nearly the entirety of Matthew 23. They knew the prophecies but were blinded because of their obsession on the law and all other traditions that were added to put men in bondage and to render mercy and justice meaningless ( Matthew 23:23) with their myopic tunnel vision. The rest of the world if NOT enlightened by the Spirit only looked at Christ as some great miracle worker but didn't worship Him as God in the flesh.
Hence Matthew 16:17 must occur for true salvation.
through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit ( 2 Tim. 3:16) which is useful for teaching; instruction in righteousness; etc. It contains
eternal truths as to the past; present and future state of man's soul as well as the environment which will exist (eventually a new heaven and earth for those saved; and the lake of fire for those whose names are NOT in the Book of Life. ( Rev. 20:15).
The functions; therefore would be a declaration of a future for those saved; to whom have been called and chosen and who have
heard His voice ( John 10:27); and for others who have not ( John 3:18) who are judged by their works and have rejected Christ
to save them from their unregenerate state.
John 16:8 shows that the function of the Holy Spirit is to reprove the world in relation to sin; righteousness and judgment.
The writings and copies of texts are so accurate that if one LETTER was off on the count of the Pentateuch (first five texts of
the Bible) it would be destroyed and started again. This also demonstrates certain patterns in scripture which I won't venture
into here; but the Bible of course is also useful for history; lessons of sins to avoid; and every other instruction manual on practical wisdom for our lives and has different forms that are poetic; prophetic; acrostic; and intersect personal lives with larger themes seemlessly. Therefore there are many applications which the Bible can be beneficial for (even as a learning tool for a given language before it was kicked out of the schools).
Hope that is a good start.
Agape; RIch P
For it has been granted to you not only to believe in Christ but also to suffer for him (Phillipians 1:29). Acts 5:41 is in a similar vein; namely being thankful for being worthy to be persecuted in His name; which is promised for all true believers. ( 2 Tim. 3:12; etal). The promise of being chastised if we are a true child of God and other sufferings aren't exactly the first thing we focus on
when it comes to God's promises. But of course if we consider these hard sayings first; we can learn to appreciate the more pleasurable promises in a greater way.
The opposite is true of course; in light of Hebrews 11:25. Sin runs its course of earthly pleasures; which lead up to eternal condemnation. For God's children; however there are pleasures evermore in His right hand ( Psalm 16:11). The fullness of life is also mentioned in that verse which corresponds with John 10:10 in living life to the full. Food and clothing are promised in the Gospels ( Matt. 6:25); (compare with 1 Kings 17:6 where the ravens brought Elijah food). Notice that shelter or a place to rest His head is mentioned as lacking in Matthew 8:20; which made some turn away from following Him. Surely Christ Himself did stay in peoples' homes for short interludes; but He also spent many nights on mountains in prayer; or sleeping on a boat.
Much prayer; of course seems to be edifying when focused on fulfilling the Great Commission. God states in Isaiah 55:11; that His word will not go out void; but accomplish His purposes. If we are doing His work; then we can be sure to reap what we sow; in terms of reward (see Psalm 126:5). Heavenly treasures are a promise for those who are serving out of a pure heart (see 2 Timothy 4:7-8). Therefore; the end ouf our sufferings in Christ will bring eternal glory that outweighs anything on earth. (see Romans 8:18). 2 Corinthians 4:17-18 also discusses "momentary afflictions" that don't compare to heavenly bliss.
Good question: Why wd this woman keep the commandments when she has the testimony of Jesus.
First, the testimony of JESUS is the Spirit of prophecy. She is clothed with the Sun, the Greater Light , sent in the fourth Day or around 4000 years after Adam, that is JESUS. JESUS said:My Father worketh hitherto, and I work- John 5:17KJV. I and my Father are One- John 10:30. Under her feet the Lesser light, the Holy Spirit, also sent in the fourth Day, gives her sustention / sustenance, furthermore, the woman is already crowned under the doctrine of the twelve Apostles chosen by our Lord JESUS.
Yes, the dragon (the man of sin, son of perdition, the Beast of the earth- Revelation 13:11 combined with 2Thes. 2) was (will be) wroth/wrath with the woman, he will persecute the woman which brought forth the MAN child -the ancient of days - the Lesser Light - and to the woman is given two wings of a great eagle -the OT and the NT -, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished - nourished by the OT and NT, the commandments and testimony of JESUS -, for a time, and times, and half a time (42 months), from the face of the serpent- Revelation 12:14KJV.
And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. And the earth(earth here is the clay- Isaiah 64:8, the dry land) helped the woman(will be 144K???), and the earth(Jewish believers) opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon (a strong DELUSION that will be sent by GOD-2Thes.2:11-12 combined with Revelation 13:11-18) cast out of his mouth.
Let us get ready, it is midnight, the bridegroom comes; let us go out to meet Him, all of us need to arise and trimmed our lamps. But wait, only lamp is not enough to walk now, it's necessary / essential to have oil, otherwise, the lamp will go out, but at midnight? in full darkness and nocturnal terrors?
Be careful
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. This speaks on a person present condition once he heareth Christ word, and believeth on him that sent him,
To be able to hear the word is a condition.
This is the blood tipped ear mentioned in scripture and also what's meant in John 10:27-28.
These verses along with many of what have been shared by others suggest that you are saved now not later.
However, just say if we are wrong, how do we stand in the day of judgement?
God is a righteous Judge and requires perfection. No one can present that!
If we're to be judged, what sins is he going to pardon?
How many times can we get away with sinning before we're condemned?
What role did the cross play in our salvation?
Why didn't he just stick with the old sacrificial systems if the blood of Christ couldn't take away sins?
These are valid questions if we are to be judged with the dead.
We must also understand that there are those predestined to be in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world ( Ephesians 1:3-6). The opposite is true for the unregenerate as seen in Revelation 17:8. Christ's death was therefore part of a plan from before Creation where all those would hear His voice who were His sheep ( John 10:27). We must remember that His death was effective from what happened in time and space 2000 years ago. It also is retroactive; as it were in order to allow those who were of old to eventually in time and space have access to heaven (see Romans 6:9). Therefore; at the Rapture ( 1 Thess. 4:15) shall involve the Resurrection of all souls of deceased saints; followed by bodily ascension of those alive and remaining. There are some verses which seem to indicate O.T. saints may arise later on in say the Midpoint of the Tribulation or near the end; there is some debate on that question. Some already apparently were resurrected ( Matt. 27:52-56). This would have been a gleaning of the firstfruits; so to speak.
My point here is predestination and the fact that God initiates repentance ( Acts 11:18); etc. There is such a thing as godly repentance and worldly ( 2 Cor. 7:10); illustrated by that of Peter and Judas Iscariot. Genuine repentance brings life and brings sorrow at offending a Holy God; worldly sorrow only is interested in consequences of our actions; and in Judas' case he only recognized Christ as having "innocent blood"; not as God's Son to be worshipped.
I don't see anywhere in scripture as you say it.
Jesus and his disciples were very direct and didn't turn to the left or right.
In Revelation he warns us of this spiritual fornication and Lukewarmness.
You mentioned Love.
Jesus displays his love for the sheep in John 10. He gives us an example of one who don't love the sheep in John 10:12-13.
These warnings and protection from the wolf is an act of love for the sheep.
Is it considered aggressive when you put so much focus on me and try to muffle me from speaking whar is true concerning this matter and taking little indirect shots on other matters?
Yes I expose their agenda when I feel someone new to the site may need a little more info to understand the direction this person is headed.
It puzzles me when you continue to step in every time I speak on this, but this group I'm referring to never denies the accusations.
Where were you when I was under attack a few months ago for not wanting to engage in a ongoing eschatology thread?
You supported it.
Sorry but we will have to disagree on this.
God bless.
Hi Jimbob. You wrote well though if I could just highlight the 'apostasy' (apostasia), as seen in 2 Thessalonians 2:3, & consider what the Apostle Paul was speaking of here. I realize that it would be simple to understand his statement as applying to believers, before that day of Christ's coming, that some would apostatize by rejecting Christ going back into the world or to embrace another religion. But are we correct to believe that this was what Paul was speaking of in light of his other writings & that of our Lord? (refs. John 10:27-29; John 6:37; 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:13,14; Ephesians 4:30; Romans 8:28-30; Jude 1:24,25; 2 Corinthians 5:17; 2 Timothy 2:19).
When we look at the definition of 'apostasy', it is as you have given ("An abandonment of what one has professed, a total desertion, or departure from one's faith, a total abandonment of the Christian faith"). But 'apostasy' is not simply restricted to a 'total departure from one's faith' but also 'a total departure or abandonment of one's principles, party, cause' (and one could even add 'departure from the Word of God which lays out the principles and Truths of doctrine & righteous living').
Unfortunately, the 2 Thessalonians 2:2-5 passage is not explicit to show us how Paul was applying this 'apostasy'. Obviously, the Thessalonian believers probably knew much more than we have been given (v5 'remember...I told you these things?'). Clearly, this apostasy doesn't relate to principles or causes of the world, because its context shows that Paul is speaking of an apostasy that will affect believers in some way. The question then is: is it the rejection of Christ altogether, or a departure/rejection of the Truth of God's Word? But isn't that the same thing, one could ask? I think you will agree Jimbob, that this rejection of Truth & promotion of unbiblical interpretations & lifestyle, has been going on for a long time - from within the Church itself.
Hi
-Please pray for understand for God will give him who ask freely.
It's written in John 10:35 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 35, If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
meaning the bible cannot contradict itself. infact Jesus Has Said this in Proverbs 8:8 All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; There is nothing froward or perverse in them.
So, my advice to you is to Kneel down and repent of your unbelief and ask The Lord Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God to Help you understand His words The sharp two- Eged sword.
In Matthew 6:22 -23. 22Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
-What we fail to see here is this, Satan entered unto peter and he is using peter to try and deceive Jesus Christ not to Go to the Cross and if The Lord Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God would have not gone to the cross then the whole bible would be compromised, and every word of prophecy would collapse just by that one action. remember Just before Jesus was arrested by the temple Gurds/solders What He said unto them. in Matthew 27:53-54
53Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? 54But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?
According to Genesis 4:15; a mark set upon Cain was to cause vengeance to anyone who would attempt to take his life. Compare this to the Mark of the Beast in Revelation 13 and we find some interesting parallels.
First; Satan was a "murderer from the beginning." ( John 8:44). It is no surprise that the first child of Adam was to be attacked after Adam and Eve fell. Having failed the test of God he let temptation rule over him and slayed Abel his brother. Satan is also said to steal and destroy ( John 10:10) along with his lying. We see the progeny of Adam and Eve being destroyed; along with stealing from the parents being able to give an inheritance and Abel receiving it.
Later on in Genesis 4:24 Lamech tries to gain vengeance by his declaration of seventy times seventy for himself for his own violent actions. Kind of like the opposite of forgiveness for the same in Matthew 18:21-22.
The apparent resurrection of Antichrist from a deadly wound as well as being able to kill the two prophets that tormented men will inspire him to declare indestructibility as well as being able to effectively fight against God. He will likely convince men that he can live forever by merging with AI; and likely the DNA of the Nephilim or something to that affect will be part of that plan; as it was in Genesis 6 when all the descendants of men were destroyed for that reason (see Genesis 6:8-9 on Noah being perfect in his generations). Hence at that time we saw no repentance except for Noah; his wife; his 3 sons and their wives.
Whatever the case men will be unredeemable once they take the mark ( Revelation 14:9 and other passages). That will be the fulfillment of 2 Thessalonians 2:11 where people willingly reject the truth and believe The Lie.
The verse on those who dwell on the earth ( Revelation 11:10; also see Revelation 6:10 and other passages) indicates the sea of lost humanity. Revelation 13:8 concludes this for all unsaved.
Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, MANY BELIEVED IN HIS NAME, ( when they saw the miracles which he did.)
BUT JESUS DID NOT COMMIT HIMSELF UNTO THEM, because he knew all men,
And needed not that any should testify of man: FOR HE KNEW WHAT WAS IN MAN.
( MANY BELIEVED IN HIS NAME,)
( BUT JESUS DID NOT COMMIT HIMSELF UNTO THEM.)
( FOR HE KNEW WHAT WAS IN MAN.)
This group that believed on his name, Could we call these his sheep?
John 6:64-66.
But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
( From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.)
"Were these his sheep"?
I believe we all agree these in Matthew 7:23 are not his sheep.
How about this group?
Are they his sheep?
"They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 1 John 2:19.
They're all sheep!
Turning back and getting lost is their nature!
It's what sheep do!
But Christ is the great shepherd and he has his own sheep!
What is the role of the shepherd?
What is the capability of the great shepherd?
Answer; John 10:27-28. "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
AND I GIVE UNTO THEM ETERNAL LIFE; AND THEY SHALL NEVER PERISH, NEITHER SHALL ANY MAN PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY HAND.
Do you see the contrast between
Jojn 10:27 and John 2:25,
1 John 2:19. Mathew 7:23 and
John 6:64-66 ?
Answer; John 10:28-29
It is vital; at this stage to reiterate that we must repent of unconfessed sin. God has designed it so that if we are not willing to do this there is great torment that can render us powerless in our walk. That is a warning to all those "confessions" of blessings "declared" on ourselves or others; it in reality brings a curse on us. The reason why is because we are in a Covenant with the Lord and therefore it is His end of the deal to not only save His people but sanctify us; "purging out the dross" ( Isaiah 1:25).
Part of the problem is that for some bizarre reason it seems to me that very few Christians shall we say overestimate Satan's threat to our well being. It seems strange since a die hard individual on the other camp doesn't seem to have too much difficulty believing in that reality; and occasionally is driven to faith in the Lord when one of his "bargains" with the enemy goes awry (his true colors are exposed). At face value; someone who seeks to kill; steal and destroy ( John 10:10) would be considered an enemy. Sometimes I think we take the love your enemies verse and twist it around; perhaps not to have sympathy for the devil; but to somehow dumb down how evil he is (probably in part because it makes our own comfortable lives in jeopardy realizing that reality). Since he is the power of the air as it were leading men astray; it should be held in conjunction with the fact that man is apart from Christ unable to do any good or as the Reformers state in "total depravity."
If we would focus on the cause rather than the effects of endless problems we see with our natural eyes in this fallen world
we may be able to live out a better walk with the Lord in our prayer lives.
Fear of death ( Hebrews 2:14-15) is something which I have struggled with; I know better but that is one of the enemies' favorite torments. God will deliver His people; but let us be diligent in prayer for ourselves and others as 1 Peter 5:9 says
I have seen currently individuals who are knowledgeable in the Word and who seem to love the Lord who argue that we can lose our salvation. I don't feel comfortable fellowshipping where that is the standard doctrine; although the conviction level for holiness seems commendable to me. Nonetheless; the enemy an cause havoc for those who would be in despair and perhaps self destructive over that type of message. Equally as concerning are those who are allowing certain sins; particularly those who support a lifestyle of sin in the church today holding onto what many call a "hyper grace" mentality. First and foremost; of course we are to test ourselves to see if we are in the faith and DO something about it if not. ( 2 Cor. 13:5). Those who are His; of course willl hear His voice ( John 10:16) and be taught by God ( John 6:45).
Blessed assurance is something which must transcend this world; and our love for God supersede any other affections and loyalties for us to be a true disciple of God ( Matt. 10:37-38). If we love Him we will obey His commandments ( John 14:15); this is a verse I have repeated quite often lately on this site.
I would make a basic comment at present that those who are His sense His love; and also recognize that when being chastised ( Hebrews 12:6). When the Spirit is grieved ( Eph 4:30-31) a true follower of Christ will be aware of it; after all He has made His (actually OUR) abode in these individuals ( John 14:23). It is also true that those who are unbelievers cannot love God but they certainly can fear Him. In today's society; however it is likely that such boldness in rebellion in the world is tied into the lack of fear of the Lord in churches. The compromised Gospel and lifestyles today I will tackle in future posts.
The book of John is something I have already covered sometime last year in detail as to the many examples proving Predestination.
John 10:18 shows us that Christ had the power to give up and take life back again. Starting at the statement at His death "it is finished" ( John 19:30) the atonement was complete at the same moment. The comment from the fellow prisoner (the one who repented) at the cross recieved a response just prior to that event where Christ assured him "today you shall be with me in paradise" ( Luke 23:43). This shows that sheol which at the time was the abode of all the dead (see state of Lazarus vs the rich man in the parable of Luke 16:19-31). Jesus came to set the captives free ( Ephesians 4:7-10) also alluded to in several other passages that could also refer to those captive in sin still on earth. He preached to the spirits in prison ( 1 Peter 3:19) which were either the demons or Nephilim and their offspring which were in the abyss before their time; or all the lost. Those who were His own were set free; their souls went to heaven and many appeared after His Resurrection ( Matt. 27:52-53). Thus; after this time only wicked in the torment part of hell still exist down there.
Christ; of course was the "first of the firstfruits" ( 1 Cor. 15:20). There will be the following afterwards; those who came out of their graves at that time as I stated above; then those at His appearing (i.e. Rapture); then those at His coming (2nd Coming). The firstfruits continue until the 144,000 which is a sort of gleaning of Israel ahead of the main harvest the countless multitude coming out of the Great Tribulation. ( Rev. 7:9).
What is most sobering is that Christ still bears marks on His body ( Luke 24:39); apparently the only one who is resurrected with such scars reminding us of his earthly suffering and existance. Hence; God did not allow His holy one to remain in sheol or see decay ( Psalm 16:10). He was the perfect; unblemished Lamb of God who we shall forever worship and adore.
Agape; Happy Resurrection Sunday.
Rich P
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:
There's only one God.
John 10:30.
John 14:7-9.
If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Jesus saith unto him, HAVE I BEEN SO LONG TIME WITH YOU, AND YET HAST THOU NOT KNOWN ME, PHILIP? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
1 Corinthians 15:28.
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, THAT GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL.
This is after the Millennium reign, Then he will establish the eternal reign.
Then he will return to his place where he was in the beginning,
( back to the God head)
"That God may be all in all"
Who raised Christ from the dead?
John 10:17-18.
Romans 8:11.
Act 13:30.
Answer; The triune God. "Elohm".
If Jesus is the body of the Father but yet a separate God as one claims. That contradicts what is written in scripture.
Ephesians 4:4-6.
"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all."
We're servants and worshipers of that one God. Now and for ever.
God will share his glory with no man.
Isaiah 42:8.
In respect to Psalm 82, this has been much quoted over the past months, even years, & I have during that time shared my understanding, so I'll mention it briefly here. But I would first ask, what is Psalm 82 speaking about - I mean the whole Psalm & not just lifting out a verse & making it mean something?
From verse 1 to verse 8, the message is the indictment of unjust wicked judges (earthly judges). And when we come to an interesting phrase in verse 6, "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High", one should immediately look to the original language of this verse & the context of the Psalm, only because if we don't do so, then any interpretation one gives might be correct.
But the word used here for "gods" is 'elohim'; and this word is a generic word, which is used of the True God, of gods, of rulers, of judges. Given the message in Psalm 82, 'elohim' certainly can't apply to the True God (which I believe you won't subscribe to either), neither to other gods or an imitation of the true, but to the judges spoken of in the Psalm. And Jesus used this verse in John 10:34, which they would have understood in entirety: that God spoke of judges, and as judges & men, they were "children of the most High". If then Jesus said, "I am the Son of God", why should these accusatory Jewish leaders accuse Jesus for claiming to also be a Son of God? And then Jesus spoke on His relationship to God by the works that He did. But those judges of Psalm 82 were wicked "and would die like men", and these too, to whom Jesus spoke, were of that ilk: judging Jesus wrongly & would stand before their Judge, the Judge of the whole Earth ( Psalm 82:8).
So, I hope you can see Donna, that we cannot use this Psalm to teach that we all become gods nor change any other Scripture to suit us.
Advocate 1 John 2:1
Shephard & Bishop of souls I Peter 2:25
Man of sorrows Isa 53.3
Judge Acts 10:42
Faithful and True Witness Rev 3:14
Head of the Church Eph 5:23
Rock 1 Corth 10:4
High Priest Heb 6:20
Master Matt 8:19
Living Water John 4:10
Rose of Sharon Song of Solomon 2:1
Alpha and Omega Rev 22:13
Lamb of God John 1:29 Messiah Daniel 9:25
Mediator I Tim 2:5
Teacher John 3:2
Author and Finisher of our Faith Heb 12:2
Image of the invisible God Col 1:15
Everlasting Father Isa 9:6
The Word John 1:1
Holy One Mark 1:24
Light of the world John 8:12
Lion of the tribe of Judah Rev 5: 5
LORD OF LORDS I Tim 6:15
The Beloved Eph 1:6
Carpenter Mark 6:3 The Almighty Rev 21:
Shiloh Gen 49:10
The Way, the Truth and The Life John 14:16
Bright and Morning Star Rev 22:16
Good Shepherd John 10:11
Son of Man Matt 20:28
Only Begotten Son John 3:16
King Of Kings 1 Tim 6:15
Prince of Peace Isa 9:6
Bridegroom Matt 9:15
Dayspring Luke 1:78
Saviour of the world Eph 5:23
Immanuel Luke 1:78 & Matt 1:23
Wonderful Counselor Isa 9:6
I AM John 8:58
The Door John 10:9
The True Vine John 15:1
King of the Jews Mark 15:26
Prophet Matt 21:11
Redeemer Job 19:25
Saviour Isa 45:15 , John 42:2, 1 Tim 4:10
The Amen Rev 3:14
The Living God
Anchor Heb 6:19
The BRANCH Zech 6:12
Bread of Life John 6:15
The Resurrection & Life John 11.25
The Living God, who is the Saviour of all men,
(Part 4):
We also know from Scripture that no one can keep himself saved. John teaches, in 1 John 5:18 (as recorded in the oldest Greek manuscripts), "We know that everyone who has been born from God does not practice sin; but the one who has been born from God, God is keeping him and the evil one does not touch him."
John also states in John 10:27-29, "My sheep hear my voice and I know them; and they follow me. And I give to them eternal life; and they will never perish forever and not anyone will seize them from out of my hand. My Father who has given them to me is greater than all, and no one is able to seize them from out of the hand of my Father."
Jude states in his doxology in verse 24, "But to the one being able to keep you without stumbling and to set you before His glory blameless in exultation."
Paul in his writings emphasized the keeping power of God's Spirit in Ephesians 1:13-14: "In whom also after having heard the Word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, in whom also, after having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is the guarantee of our inheritance, for redemption of the possession, for the praise of His glory."
He states again in Ephesians 4:30, "And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God in whom you were sealed for the day of redemption." Probably one of the most powerful Scriptures of God's keeping power is Romans 8:38-39: "For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor powers, nor any thing which has come, nor things coming, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."
The only way a person can be saved is by a spiritual birth from God; and the only way a person can keep his salvation is through the keeping power of God.
John 10:28 - neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
What about followers who voluntarily left His hand?
Luke 15:4-7 - Jesus gives the parable of the lost sheep. But the sheep is still a follower. If the sheep denounced its Shepherd and left the herd to become a wolf, Jesus doesn't say He goes to rescue wolves but just the sheep in His flock. Verse 7 also adds a condition- "if" the sheep repents. People often skip that part. Maybe it's uncomfortable for some to humble themselves to genuinely repent and ask for forgiveness to God. I think this is what Jesus expects. It doesn't say the Christian can follow the world, sin as much as he wants, abort babies, use profanity, cheat, lie, steal, kill, abuse the body with drugs, and fill with lust, and not repent, not follow Jesus and be 100% fine. I see no verse saying that is all is fine if done intentionally. Seems like doing that is like spitting in Jesus's face and mocking what He did for us.
Heb 6:1 talks about repentance. Heb 6:6 says those who have "fallen away" can be brought back through repentance. If it wasn't possible for Christians to fall away then why does the Bible say that Christians can fall away? It says its a disgrace, like crucifying Jesus all over again.
Heb 5:13 says that some Christians are still living on milk like an infant and still not pursuing righteousness. Some in this forum have claimed that effort to be righteous is "bad" and apparently doing evil is good? That of course is from satan.
Heb 5:2 talks about Christians who have gone astray or "out of the way" of the path. If it were not possible to veer off the path of following Jesus then why does the Bible warn us not to do that?
Heb 4:1 warns Christians to not fall short of God's "rest".
Heb 3:19
We have a basic exhortation as a people to be the "head" instead of the "tail" (see Deut. 28:13). As a church; we should be willing to support the brethren especially when we can see trouble coming as we see in Acts 2:45 similar to what was predicted by Agabus in Acts 11:28. Wisdom is something the Lord will give us if we ask ( James 1:5). That may apply currently to extracting finances or money from risky investments or bank accounts to have some on hand; to have emergency food supplies and a generator at hand; precious metals for trade; etc.
Our political leaders are not to be worshipped either (I am leaving names out here). There is enough at fault in both sides of the political spectrum. Whether it is possible at this point for anyone of integrity to lead our nation and for that person to win the party nomination (again no names here) is something I am not placing any bets on. Proverbs 16:18 warns us that pride comes before a fall; and certainly there is enough of that to go around. People hear what they want to hear; but those of the house of the living God will hear His voice ( John 10:27). When we hold on to this life too much; we forget that we are "seated in heavenly places" ( Eph. 2:6). That is a present state; but our future hope in glory is brought forth by natural death or martyrdom. I am convinced that we would never see the harvest of innumerable saints ( Rev. 7:9) if the 5th seal event and later killings of the Antichrist for not taking the Mark were not instituted. Apparently; "tribulum" means a threshing board using in harvest for separation purposes. Satan will be used as God's instrument to finally bring the wheat to fruition in the heat of the fires of that trial ( Rev. 3:10). As for now we should heed to the admonition of the very next verse as rewards can and will be lost for those who don't remain patient and are distracted by things of this world today. May we keep our eyes on Him.
Agape.
Psalms is the words of Christ: 2 Samuel 23:1-2
Psalms 82:6 I (Christ) have SAID, Ye are gods, the children of the most high.
Jesus himself QUOTED his OWN prophecy.
John 10:35 If HE (the spirit of prophecy) CALLED them (the children of resurrection) gods, unto whom the WORD OF GOD CAME, and the scripture CAN NOT be BROKEN.
Jesus is telling the Pharisees, they read and study the scriptures, but have no knowledge of their TRUE MEANING, very little has changed TODAY.
John 1:5 And the light shineth into darkness, and the darkness comprehended it not.
You say Psalms 82:6 means gods of this world, antichrist, sons of predition
Let's see what happens to this scripture when we apply it to mean as you define it.
I (Christ) have SAID, ye are gods (antichrist, sons of perdition, Satan, gods of this world), THE CHILDREN OF THE MOST HIGH.
Let's apply your definition to some other scriptures.
Deuteronomy 10:7 For the Lord your God is a God of gods (sons of perdition, gods of this world, antichrist)
Joshua 22:22 The Lord God of gods (gods of this world, sons of perdition, antichrist), the Lord God of gods ...
I hope you rethink what you are saying about GOD'S WORDS.
Could it possibly be your not rightly dividing God's Word, maybe Paul was talking about something completely opposite to what Christ was Prophesying.
My rebuttal is ALSO in LOVE.
Does the church you attend preach the KINGDOM of God, or is it like most churches and preaches heaven and hell?
God Bless YOU!
It looks like the thread you addressed me on has been closed t further comment. So, I will respond with a new thread.
I am happy to bring Scriptures to this conversation. But before I do, please answer me yes or no: Are you Earl Bowman?
If you do not answer this question of mine with a yes or a no, then I will know that you are a deceiver.
As to your inquiry about Psalm 82:1-6 and Jesus' usage of this Psalm in John 10:35. The context of this verse in psalms is a reference to the judges of Israel that were appointed to make judgements for the people when they had a legal matter to bring forward to resolve.
God, in this Psalm is rebuking these judges (and any leader) because they judged sinfully. They favored those who oppressed and did wickedly and would not defend or uphold the cause of the widows, orphans, and poor, but instead made judgments against these who needed right judgements and mercy. God does not speak of them favorably in this psalm.
It does say that "ye are gods" and the meaning of this is not that they are truly gods, but those who sit in the place of the only true God when they pass their judgments. Therefore, the only True God expects them to judge with justice and righteouosness, but they did not. They judged sinfully, therefore, this iniquity proves that they are not truly gods.
The Bible speaks of gods as referring to those that pagans worship. Are these gods truly gods since Scripture calls them such?
Exodus 12:12 says that God will bring judgment on all the gods of Egypt. Are these gods real or idols/false gods?
Exodus 23:13 God says to not invoke the names of their (Israelites) other gods. Were these other gods truly gods or were they false gods/idols?
Joshua 24:14 God instructs Joshua to tell the Israelites to throw away the gods of their fathers. Were these gods truly gods or were they false gods/idols?
I could list many more Scriptures where God speaks of other gods, but it is clear they are not gods. Jer. 2:11 ...
Psalms 17:15 As for ME (Christ), I will behold thy (the Father and God of Christ) face: I (Christ) will be satisfied, when I (Christ) awake (am resurrected, by the Father's SPIRIT), with THY (the Father's) likeness.
Romans 6:5 For if were be planted TOGETHER (you and Christ) in the likeness of his (Christ) DEATH; we shall also be the LIKENESS of HIS RESURRECTION.
Genesis 5:1 In that DAY (the day of the LORD; ALL MEN died with Christ and all MEN were resurrected with Christ) that God created man ( BY the resurrection), in the LIKENESS of GOD created he them.
Psalms 104:30 Thou sendest forth THY (the Father of ALL ( Ephesians 4:6) SPIRIT, THEY (all men) are CREATED; thou renewest the face of the earth.
Ezekiel 1:5 And out if the MIDST thereof (Christ) there came forth four LIVING CREATIONS, And this was their appearance, they (the new creation) had the appearance of A MAN (Christ).
Ezekiel 10:10 And as for the for their appearances (the LIVING CREATIONS), they four (the new creation) had ONE LIKENESS, as a WHEEL (Christ) in the MIDST of a WHEEL (Christ).
Colossians 1:27 ..this MYSTERY (of his resurrection) ... CHRIST IN YOU ..
Romans 8:28 For whom he (the Father of ALL) did foreknow, He (the Father) did predistinate (by the resurrection of Christ) to be conformed to the IMAGE (God) of his son, that he (Christ) might be the FIRSTBORN among many (cloned by his resurrection) BRETHREN.
Psalms 82:6 For I (the Father) have said, YE (my new creation, by your brother's resurrection) ARE GODS, the children of the most high.
John 10:35 If he (our Father, the WORD) called them (the new creation, by resurrection) GODS, unto WHOM the word of GOD CAME ( Hebrews 9:28), the scripture CANNOT be BROKEN.
Luke 20:36 Neither can THEY (the new creation) DIED ANYMORE (you died with Christ on the cross): for they are EQUAL to the ANGELS ( Isaiah 63:9...and the ANGEL of HIS (Christ in YOU) PRESENCE SAVED THEM.
Do YOU BELIEVE God's WORD?
Thou will not leave my soul in hell nor suffer thy holy 1 to see corruption....But Peter said this is just prophetic of Christ
In this dispensation, known as the Church Age, it was revealed to Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles, for it was the mystery that was not revealed to others beforehand. The Church is the body of Christ placed to be a light to the world until the day of the Lord; which is God's wrath during the seven year tribulation and his second part of the second coming at the battle of Armageddon.
God has placed every believer in his body, just as he is the head of the body, and every member is like its members, and he will never forsake them. This means that all those who believe today and are saved will never be forsaken, as Jesus himself said in John 10:28; "And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."
In this way, you can be sure that if you have put your trust in Christ alone and in the work of salvation performed on Calvary's cross with His blood, you are saved and you will never perish.
An example that comes to mind: Psalm 82:6 states, "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." And Jesus refers to it in John 10:34, "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?" The answer? 'from those Scriptures, all God's children are also gods'. I doubt if you believe that. Rather, using the basic tools first, will help us understand what is meant.
Even for example, the Bible translators, had to be firmly grounded on a set of established rules & patterns of their work before they could even begin (& the same goes for those in Bible translation today, working amongst various people groups). If the basic laws are not adhered to, I wonder what sort of mess the work of Bible translation (& even expository deliveries) would find themselves in. And by the way, I see no difference in those translating the Bible from original texts to those of us who have the Bible in our hands & read it with both understanding & discernment of the Truths within. We need those rules so as to rightly divide the Word. The Holy Spirit will then take us into a deeper understanding & application of those Truths, which makes the Bible more than a record of historical events, which is so to many casual readers.
For the believer, Jesus is our hope ( 1 Timothy 1:1), He is our peace ( Ephesians 2:14), He is the light of the world ( John 8:12), He is the good shepherd who gave His life for His sheep (All those who have surrendered their life to Him ( John 10:11), He is the head of the church ( Ephesians 1:22), He is the only one who sets us free from our sin ( John 8:36), He is our redeemer ( Job 19:25), He is the only atoning sacrifice for our sin ( 1 John 4:10), He is the Savior of those who receive Him ( Luke 2:11, John 1:12), He is the creator of all things ( Colossians 1:16-17, John 1:1-3), He is the word of God, and He is God ( John 1:1, Isaiah 9:6), He is our only way to salvation ( John 10:9, John 14:6).
There are many, many more descriptors in the Bible that tell us who Jesus is, but it would take many more posts to list them all.
They could be basing their claim on any one of the following pieces of scripture:
John 1:1, John 1:14, John 8:24, John 8:58, John 10:30-33, John 20:28, Hebrews 1:8, Colossians 2:9, Philippians 2:5-8, Psalm 45:6.
The Bible tells us that we are to worship God alone, and yet Jesus received worship and never rebuked anyone who worshipped Him. We see evidence of this in Matthew 2:2, Matthew 2:11, Matthew 14:33, Matthew 28:9, John 9:35-38, Hebrews 1:6.
Isaiah 44:6 reads, "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: "I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God besides me."
In Rev 1:17, it says "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as a dead man." In Daniel 10:8-9, Daniel did the same thing. When he saw this vision of Christ, he fell down as he was dead. In Ezekiel 1:28, Ezekiel sees the vision and he falls down as a dead man. It goes on to say "Fear not; I am the first and the last: (the designation of God, found in Isaiah 41:4, and Isaiah 48:12).
In Revelation 1:18, it says I am He that lives, and this is another designation of God found in Psalm 84:2, and Joshua 3:10.
I am He that lives. God presents Himself to the Jews as the living God. He says I am He that lives, and was dead; literally, and became dead, and behold, I am living forevermore, His resurrection, His eternalness.
And then it reads, Amen; and I have the keys of hell and of death. Keys are a symbol of authority. Those who were in charge of the temple had the keys to the temple. We are told later on that the Lord (Jesus) will be in control of hell and death.
In Matthew 16:15, Jesus asks His disciples who do you say I am? Peter had the perfect answer. Peter said "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God."
Peter was Jewish. The phrase "Son of the living God" from a Hebrew standpoint is a phrase used for God. To a Jew, claiming to be the Son of God was considered blasphemy, but that was Peter's response to who Jesus was
Part 1.
There are different religions extant which teach that Godhood is a graduated experience (God was once man) and that man can actually attain the level of Godhood. The number of religions which teach this is increasing as more polytheistic, Eastern religions are being introduced to America. Joseph Smith (founder of Mormonism) taught the following:
"God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted Man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens...I say, if you were to see him to-day, you would see him like a man in form -- like yourselves, in all the person, image, and very form as a man....it is necessary that we should understand the character and being of God, and how he came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity, I will refute that idea, and will take away and do away the veil, so that you may see....and that he was once a man like us; yea, that God himself the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth the same as Jesus Christ himself did." (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3).
Verses used to teach man can become God. The apostle Peter wrote of being "partakers of the divine nature" ( 2 Pet. 1: 4). A careful study of the text reveals the apostle is teaching that we are to acquire traits of God, such as "godliness," "virtue,", etc. (vs. 5-11). Indeed, we are to be Godlike and partake of the divine nature in this sense. Jesus used the word god in an accommodative sense in John 10: 34, 35. "God," as used in John 10 and Psalms 82: 6, is applied to superior people, rulers. Jesus, however, is not teaching that these rulers had become God as God is God.
See Part 2.