COGIC WORSHIP1 Corinthians 15:3-4:Jesus Christ is God that is a motif & descriptor of sonship and creation and
Divinity.I Worship a God that is God and Word of significant and of all IMPRINT and seal of God's nature. A God that you can do all things through his son- Philippians 4:13KJV.
Brother Jesse. Thanks again for this further batch of Scripture clarifications in Acts - very helpful. I understood what you wrote concerning the term "right hand" & certainly agree to it; and in many Scriptures this phrase comes up, having the meaning of 'a position of power & authority', which of course the Lord Jesus had, by virtue of His Divinity & completed work of Salvation for all.
But my thoughts turned to several Scriptures, some of which are Acts 7:55,56; Romans 8:34; Colossians 3:1; Hebrews 1:3; 1 Peter 3:22, etc., that certainly do imply Jesus' Divine Power & Authority, but I can't help but read of a positional aspect to it. When the words, 'seated or standing' are given, I think most of us would immediately see this aspect of Christ's 'physical' position as well (not to say, that Jesus doesn't move about in Heaven). How would you say that we should view such verses, especially the one where Stephen full of the Holy Spirit, was steadfastly ('atenizo': eyes affixed) on this wonder seeing the Risen Lord at God's right Hand? Even in this verse, & others, do we need to apply the 'right hand' as only to that of 'power & authority' & not of position? Thanks & blessings.
"Are there prophets that exist in today's world aside from having the gift of prophecy? Or are they one in the same?
I believe if one "must" have the gift of prophecy to be a Prophet.
No the question is, are Prophets around today.
I would say No.
Here's what Paul in Ephesians 2:20 says about the Church of God.
"And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Before the Canon of scripture was completed the prophet proclaimed a message from the Lord in the OT and to the early believers.
Today we have the completed revelation from God in the Bible.
Does God reveal truth to someone in a way and enable that person to deliver that message to others? Yes! He does this to all of us.
However, That doesn't make us a foretelling Prophet.
Compare what is said to what the Word of God says. If it contradicts the Bible, throw it out. If it agrees with the Bible then it us written before hand and it's not a foretelling supernatural message.
Hebrews 1:1-2 reads, " God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son,
Hi Everett. My understanding is that the word 'Trinity' (also referred as Triunity) and the word 'Triune' mean the same thing. Some people find the word 'Trinity' offensive, simply because in their minds it denotes a belief in 'three gods'. But with explanation, that erroneous belief can be corrected.
I note that you have given those words different meanings. So in my understanding, I don't believe that 'Trinity' speaks of three individuals or three gods, but the One God Who expresses Himself in the ways we read of in the Bible: and that is by His Spirit & by His Word. And both are fully within the Godhead revealing God to us in His Fullness.
The Spirit & the Word do not 'operate' independently, using their own Will or purposes to accomplish their tasks. All that the Word has accomplished, whether at the first by revelation to the prophets ( Hebrews 1:1), and now made flesh ( John 1:1,14) to be called the Son of God ( Hebrews 1:2), is what I understand from the Scriptures.
Likewise, the Spirit of God was sent out to infill people to understand & proclaim God's Word and now to baptize repentant sinners who have turned to God through faith in Jesus Christ. That the Word & the Spirit have been sent out by the Father, doesn't mean that God is now deficient in any way, remaining helpless, but all that the Father speaks & accomplishes is done by Himself alone by His Word & Spirit. I hope that I have given you a clear understanding of my position on this doctrine.
4Whatsoever is born of GOD overcometh the world:and this is the victory that overcometh the world,even our faith.
5Who is he that overcometh the world,but he that believeth that JESUS is the Son of GOD?
6JESUS is He that came by water and blood,even JESUS Christ;not by water only,but by water(John7:38-39;8:51and11:26),
and blood-understand?( Philippians 2:7-11).
And it is the Spirit that beareth witness,because the Spirit is Truth.
GOD,the Word,is Spirit- John 6:63.The Word is GOD,GOD Himself,self-executing,understand?
7There are three that testify in heaven(heaven? Ephesians 1:3-8),the Father-GOD the Father-,the Word-the Word made flesh-JESUS-,and the Holy Spirit(who is not a ghost as is written in English language,but a person-the Paraclete,the Comfort):and these three are One.
18We-the TRUE believers-know that whosoever is born of GOD sinneth not;but he that is begotten of GOD keepeth himself,and that wicked one toucheth him not.
19And we know that we are of GOD-understand?-,and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
20And we know that the Son of GOD is come,and hath given us an understanding,that we may know Him that is true,and we are in Him that is true,even in His Son Jesus Christ.This is the true GOD,and eternal life.
Hebrews 1:1-3
1GOD,who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by His Son,whom He hath appointed heir of all things,by whom also He made the worlds;
3Who being the brightness of His glory,and the EXPRESS IMAGE(WORD MADE FLESH)of the Person of GOD,and upholding all things by the Word of His power,when He had by Himself purged our sins,sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
Revelation 11:15-18 &1Corinthians15:24-27
15...The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord,and of his Christ;and He shall reign for ever and ever.
18And the NATIONS will be angry, and GOD's WRATH is come...
Thank you, brother, I know we have discussed it before and I think we both respect and care for each other as brothers. I will try not to rehash that discussion forgive me if there is some overlap, but could Christ have sinned your answer is no, I will just use this verse James 1:13, your answer, according to this verse He could not even have been tempted but Jesus was tempted or tested and Jesus stayed obedient to the Father. Temptation or testing is for an answer to whether someone will be obedient or disobedient, Romans 5:19.
1 Timothy 3:16 the word manifest is the Greek word phanero meaning to make visible, make clear. Jesus did that. In the flesh, I ask when did this happen? Did this happen when Mary conceived or when Jesus was anointed with the Holy Ghost and became the Messiah/Christ?
Hebrews 1:1-3 God spoke to us by His Son every word Jesus said was the word of God, not His. Jesus shunned Philip when he asked Jesus to show them the Father, John 14:9-10, every word Jesus said was the Father.
As I have said when God placed Adam in the garden he did not have a sinful nature but he sinned and was disobedient. Jesus was not conceived by man but by the Holy Ghost, Jesus did not have the sinful nature past down by the first Adam, but He was obedient and did not sin.
I did not say anything about the cross but after Jesus prayed in the garden asking the Father if there was any other way Jesus was obedient to the end, being beaten, nailed to the cross, and giving His life for us.
If the first Adam was created with a sinful nature could God say He saw everything He had made, and it was very good? This sinful nature has a sentence of death, and it was after Adam ate the fruit that it was applied, and it spread to all. Adam was the figure of him that was to come, Jesus, the last Adam who by His obedience we have hope. How can one be obedient if they cannot be disobedient? To say Jesus was sinless and obedient becomes a farce.
Angels are redeemed men, now in the kingdom of God, made ONE FLESH with Christ, the angel of God, by the death and resurrection of Christ, the angel of God's presence.
Isaiah 63:9 And in all their (man kinds) affections, he (Christ) was afflicted, and the angel (Christ) of HIS (the father's) presence SAVED THEM: in his (the Father's) love and in his (the Father's) pity, he redeemed them (by sacrificing his son), and carried them all the days of old.
Hebrews 1:17 ...Who maketh his angels SPIRITS, and his ministers (messengers) a flame of fire.
1 Corinthians 5:5 To deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the SPIRIT (his angels) might be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
Yes, Notwithstanding SHE (Eve, Christ's wife), by allegory, the Church of the Lord JESUS, shall BE SAVED in child bearing..... generating children for the Kingdom of GOD, through the preaching of the Gospel of Christ, the Gospel of GOD's Kingdom. This has already lasted around 2000 years or two GOD's Day: Hebrews 1:1-3
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days (last two GOD's Days-from the beginning of the fifth Day unto the END of the sixth Day)spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE(image by written) His Person(Person of GOD), and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
It's wonderful, what GOD really has revelead unto His people( Ephesians 1:3-8) makes us to fly high toward the third heaven ( Luke 20:35-36 combined with Revelation 4:1), the OT and NT are like two mighty wings to catch us and carry us to the third heaven- Luke 20:35-36 combined with John 14:3 and 17:24, and 2Corinthians 12:2-4, among many other biblical references, take a look. It's Wonderful, Indescribable, Unspeakable, ineffable. Hallelujaaaah!!!
Yes,certainly,as you said,GOD HIMSELF manifested himself to the Hebrews through the OT;which was written by the twenty-four elders,starting with Moses,understand?By the way,JESUS said GOD is Spirit- John 4:24-,what is the name of the invisible Spirit of GOD?Well,GOD had said in the beginning- Genesis 1:26(the beginning is JESUS,who is the LITERAL IMAGE of GOD,He is GOD)-, yes, GOD had said:"Let us make man in OUR image,after OUR likeness", then, both are One, and as we can see, since ancient times, since Genesis, GOD revealed He would be made flesh.
By the prophet Isaiah,who is one of the 24 elders,GOD again revealed He would be made flesh, and around 2000 years ago He LITERALLY fulfilled His promise- John 1:14-and what is the NAME that GOD chose for He Himself? The NAME that GOD chose for He Himself was/is JESUS - JOSHUA-. Luke 1:26-the angel GABRIEL was sent FROM GOD(the Word is GOD,GOD Himself,self-executing) unto a city of Galilee,named Nazareth,and said to Mary:behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a SON, and shalt call his NAME JESUS. He shall be great, and called the Son of the Highest: the Lord GOD(the Word is GOD, GOD Himself, self-executing) shall give unto Him the throne of His father David.
Remember: The Jews said to JESUS: John 8:41-we have one Father, even God. And JESUS said to the Devil, father of the Jews-Yahweh:It is written,Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD that proceedeth out of the MOUTH OF GOD-Mat.4:4.
Psalms 110:1combined with Hebrews 1:8(plus Matthew 25:11, James 2:1, Isaiah 49:14, Luke 20:42, 1 Corinthians 9:1) -
GOD said to the Lord JESUS:Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy Kingdom.
KJV Psalms 83:18, Isaiah 12:2, Exodus 6:3, Isaiah 26:4 LORD=JEHOVAH; ->JEHOVAH is another esoteric and kabbalistic and spiritist nickname of the father of the Jews.
Luke 16:5 lord=a King or one of authority,yes, see John 18:37.
The King James Version uses Lord because it fortunately is the true translation approved by the Holy Spirit. You did not make mention what verse you have compared, anyway Lord may be JESUS or others biblical personage, as you may know JESUS is the LORD of the lords; who are the others besides JESUS?
The KJV is correct and true, Biblehub is not, and its translation in this specific case is one among others that will be burned with everlasting fire, because Yahweh is the esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist name used by the esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist Judaism as it was GOD's name, but it is not, it is the name of the father of the Jews- John 8:44KJV-that is their God- 2Thessalonians 2:3-4KJV.
JESUS said: John 8:41-43KJV
41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to JESUS, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even GOD.
42 Jesus said unto them, If GOD were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from GOD(take a look in Hebrews 1:1-4); neither came I of myself, but He sent me.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my Word.
Hebrews 4:12-13KJV
12 For the Word of GOD is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in His sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of Him with whom we have to do. or we must render an account
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,2 Hath in these last days(last two Days-2000 years)spoken unto us by His Son...heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;3Who being the brightness of His glory,and the express image of His person,and upholding all things by the Word of His power,when He had by Himself purged our sins,sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high.
GOD"s Plan was to create man in the sixth Day. GOD said:Ge.1:26-Let us make man in OUR image,after OUR likeness.But without JESUS, GOD's Plan was unfeasible,so 2000 years ago the Word was made flesh,was born JESUS.It was the fourth GOD's Day,i.e. 4000 years after Adam.GOD was still working in His wonderful Plan to create man in the sixth Day,as is written,not in the begining but in the END of the sixt Day.Then the Word,GOD Himself,self-executing,and JESUS,the Greater Light of fourth GOD's Day,which lighteth every man that cometh into the world, both have worked these last 2000 years to make man according to the GOD's Plan.
Many received JESUS,to them gave He power to become sons of GOD,to them that believe on His name,which were born not of blood,nor of the will of the flesh,nor of the will of man,but of GOD-Jo.1:12-13.
Ephesians 1:3-8
GOD chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world,we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus to Himself,according to the good pleasure of His will,to the praise of the glory of His grace,wherein He has made us accepted in the Beloved.In whom we have redemption through His blood,the forgiveness of sins,according to the riches of His grace;having made known unto us the MYSTERY of His will in the dispensation of the FULNESS of TIMES...In whom also we have obtained an inheritance,being PREDESTINATED according to the purpose of Him...that we should be to the praise of His glory...
11And be ready against the third day:for the third day the Lord will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.
14And Moses went down from the mount unto the people,and sanctified the people;and they washed their clothes.
15And he said unto the people,Be ready against the third day: come not at your wives.
16And it came to pass on the third day in the morning,that there were thunders and lightnings,and a thick cloud upon the mount,and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud;so that all the people that was in the camp trembled.
17And Moses brought forth the people out of the camp to meet with GOD;and they stood at the nether part of the mount.
18And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the Lord descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.
19And when the voice of the trumpet sounded long, and waxed louder and louder, Moses spake, and GOD answered him by a voice.
20And the Lord came down upon mount Sinai, on the top of the mount: and the Lord called Moses up to the top of the mount; and Moses went up.
John 2:18-20
18Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
19Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Hebrews 1:1-2
1GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2Hath in these last days (last two Days or last 2000 years)spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
The third Day arrived, the clothes must be washed,the Lord shall descend from heaven(from the 3rd heaven),the dead in Christ shall rise first- 1Thessalonians 4:16 and Revelation 19:7-8.
Matthew 25:6-Behold,the bridegroom cometh;go ye out to meet Him.
You're welcome,Andre4risca,I enjoyed a lot your post.I thank you very much for your kind and wise reply.I confess that I was very surprised and amazed by your response.
Yes,among theologians,and believers,followers of them,there is a conception the Planet Earth is around 6,000 years old,what is a false conception.
In the other hand,the scientific conception about the age of the Earth also is empiric,I would say the empiric conception of science on Earth's age is also false and a nonsense.
That said,what matters and prevails is the Truth.Once the two conceptions above described are wrong,both are good for nothing,I will not be brought under the power of any,I will not allow myself to be carried away by either,but where I will find the Truth?This reminds me of Pilate.What is Truth?For me what matters is the Truth, exclusively.
What I know is that JESUS' own testimony about Himself is wonderful,and reveals to us in depth the mystery of His existence in the greatness of the Universe created by GOD,the Word,GOD Father,full of heavenly bodies,and here on Earth,specifically,He populated the planet with living beings,and sat in the CIRCLE of the Earth,as is written in Isaiah 40:21-22:
21Have ye not known?have ye not heard?hath it not been told you from the beginning?have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
22It is GOD that sits upon the CIRCLE of the Earth,and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers;
I remember what JESUS said from His own existence: John 17:4-5,as follow:
4I have glorified thee-Father-on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do.( John 1:3 & 5:17,and Hebrews 1:1-2 testify about this that JESUS said.Take a look)
5And now,O Father,glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the WORLD was. John the Baptist,the angel of the LORD,testified about this,saying: John 1:18- No man hath seen GOD at any time,the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father,He has declared Him.
Well,the Word is GOD,self-executing,He had a Plan:to save the mankind from the power of Devil.To execute it He needed to incarnate Himself,and He did so at the turn from the fourth to the fifth Day,so He was made flesh around 2000 years ago- Hebrews 1:1-3,He introduce Himself in the world of Devil by the name of JESUS,a LITERAL IMAGE of GOD,His Plan was to make man in His image and likeness in the SIXTH Day-Gen.1:26-Let us make man in our image,after our likeness.GOD's Plan for salvation was to preach the Gospel of His Kingdom,but by whom?Only by He Himself.
JESUS was born after week 69th,i.e.after a period of 483 years.His birth was something around 7to3BC,as this is known.
That said,GOD, now called JESUS,the stone which is become the head of the corner,He was set at nought of the builders of the OT, even the prophets which had the Spirit of Christ were killed by the builders- Matthew 23:29-35.Paul wrote:The Gospel of Christ is the power of GOD unto salvation to every one that believes;to the Jew and also to the Greek.For therein is the righteousness of GOD revealed from faith to faith: Romans 1:16-17.
Acts 4:12 reveals:Neither is there salvation in any other:for there is none other NAME under heaven given among men,whereby we must be saved.It still was the beginning of the fifth Day.
JESUS himself began to be about thirty years of age,He started His Ministry,saying:The time is fulfilled,and the Kingdom of GOD is at hand:repent ye,and believe the gospel- Mark 1:15.JESUS said to the Jews:My Father works hitherto,and I work-Jo.5:17.
JESUS said to the Father:I have glorified thee on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do.The validity of His sacrifice for salvation already last around 2000 years,more than 730.000 days,in days to come the false messiah of the Jews- John 5:43-47,Re.13:11,will enthrone himself in Jerusalem,the Abomination of desolation is established,the daily sacrifice is taken out,the Dispensation of Grace gets to the END.
JESUS' own testimony of Himself is wonderful,it reveals in depth the mystery of His existence in the greatness of the Universe created by GOD the Father,full of heavenly bodies,and on Earth specifically He populated the planet with living beings,and He sat in the circle of the Earth: Is.40:21-22:->21Have ye not known?have ye not heard?has it not been told you from the beginning?have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth? 22 It is GOD that sits upon the circle of the Earth,and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers;
That said,we must remember what JESUS said from His own existence:Jo.17:4-5:
4I have glorified thee on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do( John 1:3&5:17& Hebrews 1:1-2 testify what JESUS said.Check it)
5And now,O Father,glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the WORLD was.(John the Baptist,angel of the LORD,testified about this,saying:Jo.1:18-No man has seen GOD at any time,the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father,He has declared Him)
Paul testified:Col.1:14-16:
14 In JESUS we have redemption through His blood,even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the INVISIBLE GOD,the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by Him-by JESUS-were all things created,that are in heaven, and that are in earth,visible and invisible,whether they be thrones,or dominions,principalities,powers:all things were created by Him,and for Him:( John 1:3&5:17& Hebrews 1:1-2 confirm)
Acts 4:11-12:
11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders,which is become the head of the corner.
12Neither is there salvation in any other:for there is none other NAME(except JESUS)under heaven given among men,whereby we must be saved.
Mat.11:27-No man knows the Son,but the Father;neither knows any man the Father,save the Son,and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal Him.
No man has seen GOD,the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, He has made Him known.John1:18
You know that "no prophecy of the Scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of GOD spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit".2Pe.1:20-21.
The author to the Hebrews wrote: Hebrews 1:1-3
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days(last two GODs' Days or last around 2000 years) spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of GOD's Person( John 10:30 combined with John 5:17), and upholding all things by the Word of His power( Matthew 28:18), when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
Hallelujah!!!
And Paul Apostle wrote : 2Timothy 3:16-17
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of GOD, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of GOD may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
GOD BLESS
To the only wise GOD our Saviour, be Glory and Majesty, Dominion and Power, both now and ever. Amen.
Brian I think what you just wrote is called blasphemy which can potentially be an unforgivable sin, so you might want to be careful. So you don't believe in the Bible that says Jesus is both God ( John 1:1) and the son of God ( Hebrews 1:8). If you don't believe the Bible what is your motive for going to a Bible website and posting anti-Bible things?
The first man was made a living soul; the last man was made a quickening spirit.
MAN MADE ONLY AS A LIVING SOUL
The Word,GOD Himself,Who is from everlasting to everlasting, self-executing,He has in He Himself the project written since Eternity how to make man in His image,but GOD is Spirit,how could man see the image of His Spirit?It's impossible unless the Spirit be made physically.
The Word-the Word is GOD-GOD is Spirit and a Person,He knew it would be impossible He be known and seen in Spirit,even being a Person in He Himself as Word,so when the time arrived in to make man in His image and likeness,through His invisible Spirit and own Person as manifested Word,two distincts Persons,then He said:Let US make man in OUR image,after our likeness.
The Person of GOD as Word still was in His bosom.The Word had not still been made flesh,then was only a man made of the dust. With the revelation of the Word was given life to the man,through the Word was breathed into the nostrils of man the breath of life; and man became a living soul from the beginning until JESUS.
A MAN MADE AS LIVING SPIRIT-THIS ONLY AFTER JESUS
GOD had planned to make man in His image,but how?once He was Spirit and only One,as whether was alone?First He needed to make an image from He Himself and that's what GOD did with the birth of JESUS.JESUS was born in the turn of the fourth to the fifth Day,in the turn of fourth to the fifth millennium.JESUS was no longer in the bosom of the Father,the Word- Hebrews 1:1-4.
With the birth of JESUS,GOD could fulfill His wonderful promise to make man in His image,a quickning spirit,as planned.From JESUS until now passed more 2000 years,so we are at the turn of the sixth to the seventh and last Day, the Lord's Day,or seventh and last millennium,the millennium of GOD's Kingdom- Revelation 11:15-18,so in fulfillment of what says the Word,the dead shall be raised incorruptible-1 Cor.15:52-, and we that are alive shall be changed- Philippians 3:20-21.
I added Hebrews 1:8 to my verses list, thank you. These are useful when human opinion drifts away from scripture to remind what the scripture actually says.
JESUS is the KING of kings - kings made by He Himself - Re.1:8 and 5:10, and LORD of the lords. Michael is a lord, a Prince of GOD. JESUS sent him to the isle of Patmos-Re.1:1. Revelation 22:8-9 clarify: 8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down TO WORSHIP before the feet of the ANGEL which shewed me these things. 9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship GOD.
JESUS is God- Hebrews 1:8, not an angel, nor Archangel. JESUS and Michael are two distincts persons. By the way, Michael the Archangel fought / contended against the Devil when he disputed about the body of Moses (by allegory we may understand Israel was the body of Moses), and now again he shall contend with the old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world, fighting/ disputing about the Body od Christ: now, even now, from now, in the time of Apocalypse, Satan now called red Dragon, he shall be cast out from this current heavenly environment- Ephesians 1:3-8- into the earth, and his messengers shall be also cast out with him.
Michael shall cast Satan into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more.
Who comes first, Michael or JESUS? It's very important, for in this current time, yes, even now, after around 2000 years or after two GOD's Days- Hebrews 1:1to4- so it is
as the lightning that cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall the coming of the Son of man be. Get ready- Matthew 25:10-, knowing that only lamp- Psalm 119:105-is not suffice to enter in the kingdom of GOD - Matthew 7:21-27 and Malachi 4:11-14.
Michael the archangel is one like unto the Son of man, the difference is that Michael is a warrior, JESUS the Savior, He is the stone which is become the head of the corner. There is no salvation in any other(except in JESUS Christ):for there is none other NAME under heaven given among men, whereby we MUST be saved.
JESUS/JOSHUA warned: ... no man cometh unto the Father, but by me, so Adonai, Jehovah, YHWH, Yahweh, HaShem, Yehovah, Elohim, Yahusha , YEHshia, YEHvah, ten supposed and fictitious names, better, NICKNAMES of GOD, added in the Jewish Bible, and inadvertently copied into the Gentile Bible by the translators, they all are good for nothing.
Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. But who comes first that will cause to happen Great Tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. My Lord JESUS made it very clear, saying: Except those days (this current time) should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
A false messiah is at door, he will manifest himself soon- Revelation 13:11-14 combined with John 5:43-47-AN IMPOSTOR- , he was born decadas ago, understand? It is he the God of the Jews- 2Thessalonians 2:3-4.
My Lord JESUS warned: If any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; BELEIVE IT NOT.
In response to you request, my Bible is written in Portuguese, translated by Joo Ferreira de Almeida, printed by Imprensa Bblica Brasileira, created in 1940, adding a system of biblical references, and a concise or compact biblical dictionary translated from English by Dr. S.L. Watson and wife, Mrs Ana, former missionaries in Brazil.
I'm from Brazil, I live in the south of Brazil, close to Argentina, now it's 1.05 AM here.
As for the Jewish calendar, I agree with you, saying, "Being a Jew does not make his calendar correct", and That's exactly what I tried to demonstrate in my post yesterday, asking the following question: How to explain the difference of exactly 240 years in the Jewish calendar? In my understanding, I find this difference in the calendar of a genuinely biblical people created and developed by GOD very strange.
So I suggested three specifics events at facts that are a stain on the nation's history of Israel , actually shameful events in the history of Israel as probable causes of the difference between the Jewish calendar and the Biblical Chronology. The three events are:
1-The Jewish Calendar begins in Seth, not in Adam, so we have less 130 years here;
2-Jews do not consider their 40 years of wandering in the desert, from Egypt to the promised land;
3-They do not consider also their shameful 70 years of captivity in Babylon.
What other explanation could there be that would justify this difference of exactly 240 years?
NOTE:Not only their calendar is a nonsense,biblicaly uncorrect,as we all can see,but also a devilish colection of fictitious GOD's NAMES that they added in the Jewish Bible by their esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist spirit, even calling GOD's name through four capital letters YHWH or YHVH among other nine pseudo names,which are not named by the Holy Spirit,but by the spirit of the Evil,the Wicked- John 8:44.The true and only NAME of GOD is revealed, for example, in Acts 4:11-13 and Hebrews 1:8.
I work with the Word of GOD, and I have already answered your questions several times.
I work with the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD Himself, don't you understand? Two thousand years ago the Word Himself was made flesh by the NAME of JESUS, yes, by the NAME of JESUS, as He promised to His people through the prophets- Hebrews 1:1-3, as I have said in answering your questions. But you are masked by a pretense, and you pretend have not seen, your lack of interest in the Word of GOD reveals who really dominates your life.
I reapeat. I work with the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD Himself, don't you understand? Why do you not understand my speech? It's because you are unable to hear the true and pure Word of Truth. Your lack of interest in the Word of GOD reveals who dominates you your life.
I repeat. I work with the Word of GOD, and I have already answered your questions several times, but not according your evil and disguised spirit, for the Word of GOD -the Word is GOD Himself- recommends saying: Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you also be like unto him-Prov.26:4. And the Word states that "when the fool speaks pleasantly, believe him not / don't trust him: for there are SEVEN abominations in his heart. And my Lord JESUS clearly revealed, saying: Luke 11:23-24 and 26:
23 He that is not with me is against me: and he that gathereth not with me scattereth.
24 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.
26 Then goeth he, and taketh to him SEVEN other spirits more wicked than himself; and they enter in, and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.
Furthemore, my Lord JESUS left very clear, saying: John 12:47-48:
If any man hear my words, and believe not, I Judge him not: for I came not to Judge the world, but to save the world. But already hath one that Judgeth him:...
Chris, my belief regarding JESUS sat at the right hand of the Father, it is not by your very poor testimony of Him, but by the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD Himself, GOD the Father, understand? Hebrews 1:1-3 among other biblical references.Take a look. The testimony of the Word -the Word is GOD - it is greater than yours, understand? Or isn't it?
You called God "(Theos); Father (Patter;Abba-more intimate); Lord(Kurios), well, by the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD, you are saying nothing, your testimony about GOD in your post is irrelevant, insignificant, it was not by the Spirit of Christ, and it was not by the Spirit of Truth and John 16:12-15 confirm / endorse what I am just saying. Unfortunately you keep snaking in devilish doctrines and tares sowed by the Wicked one. --> By the way, "It is GOD that sitteth upon the circle of the Earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers- Isaiah 40:22. Indeed, this revelation which GOD did give to Isaiah explains or suggests why there is not Life in whole Universe except in the Earth, I mean out of the Earth there is not in whole Universe the variety of Life that there is in the Earth, because GOD is sat upon the circle of the Earth.
To finish, you have cited in your posts the NAME of GOD as being the esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist JEHOVAH, YAHWEH, YHWH, ADONAI, EL SHADAI, HaSHEM, so I quoted John 17:6 where my Lord JESUS in His prayer said to the Father that He had MANIFESTED His NAME to the MEN that He, GOD the Father, had given to Him, So I asked UNTO you: What is the GOD's NAME my Lord JESUS MANIFESTED to the men?
Now, now, from your knowledge you said here the names mentioned above are NAMES of GOD, so I wanted to know which of these NAMES of GOD my Lord JESUS would have manifested to the men? The question is mine, not yours, I'm waiting you response.
Well Oseas, from reading of your beliefs, I'm unable to place where you exactly are with this. You were first dealing with the Name of God in Isaiah. You've now quoted Acts 7:53-58, particularly verse 55, "But he (Stephen), being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God". In the NT, Koine Greek is the language used. If you believe that the Hebrew 'Yahweh' written of God in the OT is a devilish name, does this also apply to the Greek word for God: 'Theos'?
You asked, "what GOD's NAME was manifested by my Lord JESUS?" Yet, reading the rest of your comments, it appears to me that you hold to an "only Jesus is in Heaven" position, that when Jesus was made flesh, "GOD called Himself Jesus.." Really!!! So, as not to be mistaken, are you in that camp, that says 'that since God is in Christ that only Jesus is now in Heaven'? I'm hoping that I've misunderstood you, as we know most assuredly that when Jesus ascended into Heaven, He went back to the Father & is seated at His right Hand ( John 20:17, Acts 2:32,33, Romans 8:34, Hebrews 1:3, 1 Peter 3:22, etc.). So, NOT two Gods, but the One God, with Jesus His Son Who came forth out of God now distinct from Him through the incarnation. Thus He rightly fully claims the eternity of the Godhead (the Alpha & Omega), & also receives the worship of all. So your comments are troubling, if that is your position.
It is true Ronald, that most of those Scriptures you've cited certainly show that there is only One God & none else. I can wholeheartedly agree with that belief, that we together share in.
You also mentioned the Holy Spirit. Without introducing the Holy Spirit into this thread but for the sake of comparison & meditation, I'm sure you wouldn't deny that God sent out His Spirit to accomplish His Work in the World & in hearts ( John 16:7-11, & others). How can God send out His Spirit, & yet be Who He is, without being grossly deficient in His Being? Is God now Spirit-less since the Holy Spirit has been sent into the World & how can the Spirit also be dissected into millions of 'parts' (Spirits), filling each true believer with Himself, i.e. with God's Presence in them? Likewise, if God can do so with His Spirit & still be Spirit Himself, & this is a mystery to us, can He not also do so with His Word? Does this leave God devoid of knowledge, speech or thought, because He sent out His Word first by the prophets, then in & through His Son? ( Hebrews 1:1-3). The difference here now is, this Word was not just a spoken Word, but the "Word was made flesh". We couldn't say this, nor have read that any prophet of the OT, having received the Word, was made flesh.
With the many Scriptures that have already been given, I find it very reasonable to believe that this Word was treated just as God did with His Spirit. God sent out His Word in the olden days via His prophets, but the time had come when His Word would be sent out in His Son. If all we had was the account in Matthew 1:20-25 that Mary gave birth to a special Son, from the Holy Seed of God, then yes, this appearance of this One called Emmanuel & Jesus, was indeed a fresh creation by God to bring out His Word, not just in speech form, but in demonstration of the Holiness of God, His Power, His Love, & ultimately, His Sacrifice. Onto Page 2.
As I said I am not the best in explaining my understanding and I will try, I feel you deserve it, for you have been gracious to even discuss this with me.
1 Corinthians 15:47 This is after Jesus was raised from the dead and Paul is saying our Lord. First the earthy the first Adam then the spiritual the last Adam Jesus who did come from heaven when Jesus, God's Son was conceived in Mary's womb.
We see in Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Jesus defeated death because He was without sin the firstborn from the dead the only man who lived a perfect life. After He was baptized and anointed God gave Him authority John 5:26-27.
Matthew 1:20Acts 17:31Rev. 12:5 My understanding is the preexistence of Jesus was in God's plan before anything was created. A man caused sin to enter mankind and it had to be a man to live a perfect life to fulfill and make void the law, God could not do that.
Hebrews 1:5 Jesus is not a God there is only one true God, Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. a man who is God's Son conceived in Mary, who God raised in a glorified body and placed Him on His right side on His throne above all that is in heaven and earth and under the earth.
1 Corinthians 15:24-28; Philippians 2:9: yes, as a Son, Jesus is now subject to His Father & is exalted above all. Yet, the question remains unanswered, 'Who was Jesus prior to His Coming?' He wasn't called Jesus (though some believe in Christophany-type appearances in the OT), but the Scriptures, as I gave earlier, point to Him coming forth from within God.
1 Peter 1:19-21: "If Jesus pre-existed how could he be foreordained?" Jesus was foreordained before His coming to Earth - that was God's Plan & Purpose for redemption. But this verse tells us that Jesus was in God's Plan, but it doesn't speak of where Jesus came from at the beginning; this One Who from God, had framed the worlds ( Hebrews 1:2). I would think it nonsense if any would believe that Jesus, after His appearing, then ascended to the Father, & then made the worlds.
Rather than listing the Scriptures that show Jesus in the Flesh & returning to His Father triumphant (which we all agree to), we need to focus on whether the Scriptures show that He had a beginning before His earthly appearance - and these I gave which have not been addressed. Anyway, we'll leave it for now, as per your wish brother, but if any other 'non-trinitarian' wishes to continue this & specifically to exegete the Scriptures I gave earlier, then I will continue with it, as it is a most important doctrine to understand. Blessings.
To Brother Ronald Whittemore & others. I'm unable to respond to Ronald's last response to me, as the Reply button is missing (probably purposely done to limit the comments in that thread). So this one comes as a new Thread to address those matters.
Page 1.
Thanks again Ronald, and I note that you would like a recess on this discussion. But if I might briefly address the Scriptures you shared & why I believe that they don't answer the question, 'was Jesus' first appearance only from the womb of Mary, or did He exist in another Form within the Person of God?'
To your references:
1 Corinthians 15:47: "the second man is the Lord from Heaven" (not a Man Who became Lord, Who went into Heaven & then returned to Earth as Lord from Heaven - but the Lord Who was in Heaven & came to Earth, unlike the first man, Adam, Who was created from the Earth & back to the Earth he went).
1 Timothy 2:5: yes, Jesus is the Mediator now between God & mankind after His ascension.
Matthew 1:20, Acts 17:31, Revelation 12:5: yes again, all point to Jesus as a Man/Babe Who came from God - but no direct reference to any previous existence.
Hebrews 1:5: indeed, Jesus became the Son of God by virtue of this miraculous Birth, but then God would have created another god, because 'all the angels of God are to worship Him'; & none can receive worship but God alone. You asked, "How could God say I will be to him a Father and he shall be to me a Son if Jesus eternally existed with the Father?" Because God took His Word & gave Flesh to that Word, and this Flesh was brought into the World by the Work of God, which made this One called Jesus, God's Son. Jesus only became the Son of God at the Incarnation.
Hebrews 2:7: Jesus was made "a little lower than the angels" by virtue of His Humanity. It seems there is an order of created beings before God: the angels being above humanity, of which Jesus was made, thus subjecting Him to being our equal.
COGIC WORSHIP1 Corinthians 15:3-4:Jesus Christ is God that is a motif & descriptor of sonship and creation and
Divinity.I Worship a God that is God and Word of significant and of all IMPRINT and seal of God's nature. A God that you can do all things through his son- Philippians 4:13KJV.
But my thoughts turned to several Scriptures, some of which are Acts 7:55,56; Romans 8:34; Colossians 3:1; Hebrews 1:3; 1 Peter 3:22, etc., that certainly do imply Jesus' Divine Power & Authority, but I can't help but read of a positional aspect to it. When the words, 'seated or standing' are given, I think most of us would immediately see this aspect of Christ's 'physical' position as well (not to say, that Jesus doesn't move about in Heaven). How would you say that we should view such verses, especially the one where Stephen full of the Holy Spirit, was steadfastly ('atenizo': eyes affixed) on this wonder seeing the Risen Lord at God's right Hand? Even in this verse, & others, do we need to apply the 'right hand' as only to that of 'power & authority' & not of position? Thanks & blessings.
Welcome to the site!
You asked;
"Are there prophets that exist in today's world aside from having the gift of prophecy? Or are they one in the same?
I believe if one "must" have the gift of prophecy to be a Prophet.
No the question is, are Prophets around today.
I would say No.
Here's what Paul in Ephesians 2:20 says about the Church of God.
"And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Before the Canon of scripture was completed the prophet proclaimed a message from the Lord in the OT and to the early believers.
Today we have the completed revelation from God in the Bible.
Does God reveal truth to someone in a way and enable that person to deliver that message to others? Yes! He does this to all of us.
However, That doesn't make us a foretelling Prophet.
Compare what is said to what the Word of God says. If it contradicts the Bible, throw it out. If it agrees with the Bible then it us written before hand and it's not a foretelling supernatural message.
Hebrews 1:1-2 reads, " God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son,
I hope this helps.
God bless.
I note that you have given those words different meanings. So in my understanding, I don't believe that 'Trinity' speaks of three individuals or three gods, but the One God Who expresses Himself in the ways we read of in the Bible: and that is by His Spirit & by His Word. And both are fully within the Godhead revealing God to us in His Fullness.
The Spirit & the Word do not 'operate' independently, using their own Will or purposes to accomplish their tasks. All that the Word has accomplished, whether at the first by revelation to the prophets ( Hebrews 1:1), and now made flesh ( John 1:1,14) to be called the Son of God ( Hebrews 1:2), is what I understand from the Scriptures.
Likewise, the Spirit of God was sent out to infill people to understand & proclaim God's Word and now to baptize repentant sinners who have turned to God through faith in Jesus Christ. That the Word & the Spirit have been sent out by the Father, doesn't mean that God is now deficient in any way, remaining helpless, but all that the Father speaks & accomplishes is done by Himself alone by His Word & Spirit. I hope that I have given you a clear understanding of my position on this doctrine.
4Whatsoever is born of GOD overcometh the world:and this is the victory that overcometh the world,even our faith.
5Who is he that overcometh the world,but he that believeth that JESUS is the Son of GOD?
6JESUS is He that came by water and blood,even JESUS Christ;not by water only,but by water(John7:38-39;8:51and11:26),
and blood-understand?( Philippians 2:7-11).
And it is the Spirit that beareth witness,because the Spirit is Truth.
GOD,the Word,is Spirit- John 6:63.The Word is GOD,GOD Himself,self-executing,understand?
7There are three that testify in heaven(heaven? Ephesians 1:3-8),the Father-GOD the Father-,the Word-the Word made flesh-JESUS-,and the Holy Spirit(who is not a ghost as is written in English language,but a person-the Paraclete,the Comfort):and these three are One.
18We-the TRUE believers-know that whosoever is born of GOD sinneth not;but he that is begotten of GOD keepeth himself,and that wicked one toucheth him not.
19And we know that we are of GOD-understand?-,and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
20And we know that the Son of GOD is come,and hath given us an understanding,that we may know Him that is true,and we are in Him that is true,even in His Son Jesus Christ.This is the true GOD,and eternal life.
Hebrews 1:1-3
1GOD,who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by His Son,whom He hath appointed heir of all things,by whom also He made the worlds;
3Who being the brightness of His glory,and the EXPRESS IMAGE(WORD MADE FLESH)of the Person of GOD,and upholding all things by the Word of His power,when He had by Himself purged our sins,sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
Revelation 11:15-18 &1Corinthians15:24-27
15...The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord,and of his Christ;and He shall reign for ever and ever.
18And the NATIONS will be angry, and GOD's WRATH is come...
Be careful and Get ready
Thank you, brother, I know we have discussed it before and I think we both respect and care for each other as brothers. I will try not to rehash that discussion forgive me if there is some overlap, but could Christ have sinned your answer is no, I will just use this verse James 1:13, your answer, according to this verse He could not even have been tempted but Jesus was tempted or tested and Jesus stayed obedient to the Father. Temptation or testing is for an answer to whether someone will be obedient or disobedient, Romans 5:19.
1 Timothy 3:16 the word manifest is the Greek word phanero meaning to make visible, make clear. Jesus did that. In the flesh, I ask when did this happen? Did this happen when Mary conceived or when Jesus was anointed with the Holy Ghost and became the Messiah/Christ?
Hebrews 1:1-3 God spoke to us by His Son every word Jesus said was the word of God, not His. Jesus shunned Philip when he asked Jesus to show them the Father, John 14:9-10, every word Jesus said was the Father.
As I have said when God placed Adam in the garden he did not have a sinful nature but he sinned and was disobedient. Jesus was not conceived by man but by the Holy Ghost, Jesus did not have the sinful nature past down by the first Adam, but He was obedient and did not sin.
I did not say anything about the cross but after Jesus prayed in the garden asking the Father if there was any other way Jesus was obedient to the end, being beaten, nailed to the cross, and giving His life for us.
If the first Adam was created with a sinful nature could God say He saw everything He had made, and it was very good? This sinful nature has a sentence of death, and it was after Adam ate the fruit that it was applied, and it spread to all. Adam was the figure of him that was to come, Jesus, the last Adam who by His obedience we have hope. How can one be obedient if they cannot be disobedient? To say Jesus was sinless and obedient becomes a farce.
God bless,
RLW
Angels are redeemed men, now in the kingdom of God, made ONE FLESH with Christ, the angel of God, by the death and resurrection of Christ, the angel of God's presence.
Isaiah 63:9 And in all their (man kinds) affections, he (Christ) was afflicted, and the angel (Christ) of HIS (the father's) presence SAVED THEM: in his (the Father's) love and in his (the Father's) pity, he redeemed them (by sacrificing his son), and carried them all the days of old.
Hebrews 1:17 ...Who maketh his angels SPIRITS, and his ministers (messengers) a flame of fire.
1 Corinthians 5:5 To deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the SPIRIT (his angels) might be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
God Bless You
Yes, Notwithstanding SHE (Eve, Christ's wife), by allegory, the Church of the Lord JESUS, shall BE SAVED in child bearing..... generating children for the Kingdom of GOD, through the preaching of the Gospel of Christ, the Gospel of GOD's Kingdom. This has already lasted around 2000 years or two GOD's Day: Hebrews 1:1-3
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days (last two GOD's Days-from the beginning of the fifth Day unto the END of the sixth Day)spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE(image by written) His Person(Person of GOD), and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
It's wonderful, what GOD really has revelead unto His people( Ephesians 1:3-8) makes us to fly high toward the third heaven ( Luke 20:35-36 combined with Revelation 4:1), the OT and NT are like two mighty wings to catch us and carry us to the third heaven- Luke 20:35-36 combined with John 14:3 and 17:24, and 2Corinthians 12:2-4, among many other biblical references, take a look. It's Wonderful, Indescribable, Unspeakable, ineffable. Hallelujaaaah!!!
GOD BLESS
Matthew 28:19
John 10:30
Colossians 2:8-9
Hebrews 1:8
1 John 5:20
John 10:30
etc
Try searching 'Godhead'
Yes,certainly,as you said,GOD HIMSELF manifested himself to the Hebrews through the OT;which was written by the twenty-four elders,starting with Moses,understand?By the way,JESUS said GOD is Spirit- John 4:24-,what is the name of the invisible Spirit of GOD?Well,GOD had said in the beginning- Genesis 1:26(the beginning is JESUS,who is the LITERAL IMAGE of GOD,He is GOD)-, yes, GOD had said:"Let us make man in OUR image,after OUR likeness", then, both are One, and as we can see, since ancient times, since Genesis, GOD revealed He would be made flesh.
By the prophet Isaiah,who is one of the 24 elders,GOD again revealed He would be made flesh, and around 2000 years ago He LITERALLY fulfilled His promise- John 1:14-and what is the NAME that GOD chose for He Himself? The NAME that GOD chose for He Himself was/is JESUS - JOSHUA-. Luke 1:26-the angel GABRIEL was sent FROM GOD(the Word is GOD,GOD Himself,self-executing) unto a city of Galilee,named Nazareth,and said to Mary:behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a SON, and shalt call his NAME JESUS. He shall be great, and called the Son of the Highest: the Lord GOD(the Word is GOD, GOD Himself, self-executing) shall give unto Him the throne of His father David.
Remember: The Jews said to JESUS: John 8:41-we have one Father, even God. And JESUS said to the Devil, father of the Jews-Yahweh:It is written,Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD that proceedeth out of the MOUTH OF GOD-Mat.4:4.
Psalms 110:1combined with Hebrews 1:8(plus Matthew 25:11, James 2:1, Isaiah 49:14, Luke 20:42, 1 Corinthians 9:1) -
GOD said to the Lord JESUS:Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy Kingdom.
KJV Psalms 83:18, Isaiah 12:2, Exodus 6:3, Isaiah 26:4 LORD=JEHOVAH; ->JEHOVAH is another esoteric and kabbalistic and spiritist nickname of the father of the Jews.
Luke 16:5 lord=a King or one of authority,yes, see John 18:37.
The King James Version uses Lord because it fortunately is the true translation approved by the Holy Spirit. You did not make mention what verse you have compared, anyway Lord may be JESUS or others biblical personage, as you may know JESUS is the LORD of the lords; who are the others besides JESUS?
The KJV is correct and true, Biblehub is not, and its translation in this specific case is one among others that will be burned with everlasting fire, because Yahweh is the esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist name used by the esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist Judaism as it was GOD's name, but it is not, it is the name of the father of the Jews- John 8:44KJV-that is their God- 2Thessalonians 2:3-4KJV.
JESUS said: John 8:41-43KJV
41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to JESUS, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even GOD.
42 Jesus said unto them, If GOD were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from GOD(take a look in Hebrews 1:1-4); neither came I of myself, but He sent me.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my Word.
Hebrews 4:12-13KJV
12 For the Word of GOD is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in His sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of Him with whom we have to do. or we must render an account
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,2 Hath in these last days(last two Days-2000 years)spoken unto us by His Son...heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;3Who being the brightness of His glory,and the express image of His person,and upholding all things by the Word of His power,when He had by Himself purged our sins,sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high.
GOD"s Plan was to create man in the sixth Day. GOD said:Ge.1:26-Let us make man in OUR image,after OUR likeness.But without JESUS, GOD's Plan was unfeasible,so 2000 years ago the Word was made flesh,was born JESUS.It was the fourth GOD's Day,i.e. 4000 years after Adam.GOD was still working in His wonderful Plan to create man in the sixth Day,as is written,not in the begining but in the END of the sixt Day.Then the Word,GOD Himself,self-executing,and JESUS,the Greater Light of fourth GOD's Day,which lighteth every man that cometh into the world, both have worked these last 2000 years to make man according to the GOD's Plan.
Many received JESUS,to them gave He power to become sons of GOD,to them that believe on His name,which were born not of blood,nor of the will of the flesh,nor of the will of man,but of GOD-Jo.1:12-13.
Ephesians 1:3-8
GOD chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world,we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus to Himself,according to the good pleasure of His will,to the praise of the glory of His grace,wherein He has made us accepted in the Beloved.In whom we have redemption through His blood,the forgiveness of sins,according to the riches of His grace;having made known unto us the MYSTERY of His will in the dispensation of the FULNESS of TIMES...In whom also we have obtained an inheritance,being PREDESTINATED according to the purpose of Him...that we should be to the praise of His glory...
11And be ready against the third day:for the third day the Lord will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.
14And Moses went down from the mount unto the people,and sanctified the people;and they washed their clothes.
15And he said unto the people,Be ready against the third day: come not at your wives.
16And it came to pass on the third day in the morning,that there were thunders and lightnings,and a thick cloud upon the mount,and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud;so that all the people that was in the camp trembled.
17And Moses brought forth the people out of the camp to meet with GOD;and they stood at the nether part of the mount.
18And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the Lord descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.
19And when the voice of the trumpet sounded long, and waxed louder and louder, Moses spake, and GOD answered him by a voice.
20And the Lord came down upon mount Sinai, on the top of the mount: and the Lord called Moses up to the top of the mount; and Moses went up.
John 2:18-20
18Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
19Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Hebrews 1:1-2
1GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2Hath in these last days (last two Days or last 2000 years)spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
The third Day arrived, the clothes must be washed,the Lord shall descend from heaven(from the 3rd heaven),the dead in Christ shall rise first- 1Thessalonians 4:16 and Revelation 19:7-8.
Matthew 25:6-Behold,the bridegroom cometh;go ye out to meet Him.
Yes,among theologians,and believers,followers of them,there is a conception the Planet Earth is around 6,000 years old,what is a false conception.
In the other hand,the scientific conception about the age of the Earth also is empiric,I would say the empiric conception of science on Earth's age is also false and a nonsense.
That said,what matters and prevails is the Truth.Once the two conceptions above described are wrong,both are good for nothing,I will not be brought under the power of any,I will not allow myself to be carried away by either,but where I will find the Truth?This reminds me of Pilate.What is Truth?For me what matters is the Truth, exclusively.
What I know is that JESUS' own testimony about Himself is wonderful,and reveals to us in depth the mystery of His existence in the greatness of the Universe created by GOD,the Word,GOD Father,full of heavenly bodies,and here on Earth,specifically,He populated the planet with living beings,and sat in the CIRCLE of the Earth,as is written in Isaiah 40:21-22:
21Have ye not known?have ye not heard?hath it not been told you from the beginning?have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
22It is GOD that sits upon the CIRCLE of the Earth,and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers;
I remember what JESUS said from His own existence: John 17:4-5,as follow:
4I have glorified thee-Father-on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do.( John 1:3 & 5:17,and Hebrews 1:1-2 testify about this that JESUS said.Take a look)
5And now,O Father,glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the WORLD was. John the Baptist,the angel of the LORD,testified about this,saying: John 1:18- No man hath seen GOD at any time,the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father,He has declared Him.
Well,the Word is GOD,self-executing,He had a Plan:to save the mankind from the power of Devil.To execute it He needed to incarnate Himself,and He did so at the turn from the fourth to the fifth Day,so He was made flesh around 2000 years ago- Hebrews 1:1-3,He introduce Himself in the world of Devil by the name of JESUS,a LITERAL IMAGE of GOD,His Plan was to make man in His image and likeness in the SIXTH Day-Gen.1:26-Let us make man in our image,after our likeness.GOD's Plan for salvation was to preach the Gospel of His Kingdom,but by whom?Only by He Himself.
JESUS was born after week 69th,i.e.after a period of 483 years.His birth was something around 7to3BC,as this is known.
That said,GOD, now called JESUS,the stone which is become the head of the corner,He was set at nought of the builders of the OT, even the prophets which had the Spirit of Christ were killed by the builders- Matthew 23:29-35.Paul wrote:The Gospel of Christ is the power of GOD unto salvation to every one that believes;to the Jew and also to the Greek.For therein is the righteousness of GOD revealed from faith to faith: Romans 1:16-17.
Acts 4:12 reveals:Neither is there salvation in any other:for there is none other NAME under heaven given among men,whereby we must be saved.It still was the beginning of the fifth Day.
JESUS himself began to be about thirty years of age,He started His Ministry,saying:The time is fulfilled,and the Kingdom of GOD is at hand:repent ye,and believe the gospel- Mark 1:15.JESUS said to the Jews:My Father works hitherto,and I work-Jo.5:17.
JESUS said to the Father:I have glorified thee on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do.The validity of His sacrifice for salvation already last around 2000 years,more than 730.000 days,in days to come the false messiah of the Jews- John 5:43-47,Re.13:11,will enthrone himself in Jerusalem,the Abomination of desolation is established,the daily sacrifice is taken out,the Dispensation of Grace gets to the END.
That said,we must remember what JESUS said from His own existence:Jo.17:4-5:
4I have glorified thee on the earth:I have finished the work which thou gave me to do( John 1:3&5:17& Hebrews 1:1-2 testify what JESUS said.Check it)
5And now,O Father,glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the WORLD was.(John the Baptist,angel of the LORD,testified about this,saying:Jo.1:18-No man has seen GOD at any time,the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father,He has declared Him)
Paul testified:Col.1:14-16:
14 In JESUS we have redemption through His blood,even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the INVISIBLE GOD,the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by Him-by JESUS-were all things created,that are in heaven, and that are in earth,visible and invisible,whether they be thrones,or dominions,principalities,powers:all things were created by Him,and for Him:( John 1:3&5:17& Hebrews 1:1-2 confirm)
Acts 4:11-12:
11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders,which is become the head of the corner.
12Neither is there salvation in any other:for there is none other NAME(except JESUS)under heaven given among men,whereby we must be saved.
Mat.11:27-No man knows the Son,but the Father;neither knows any man the Father,save the Son,and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal Him.
No man has seen GOD,the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, He has made Him known.John1:18
Thank you for your significative reply.
You know that "no prophecy of the Scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of GOD spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit".2Pe.1:20-21.
The author to the Hebrews wrote: Hebrews 1:1-3
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days(last two GODs' Days or last around 2000 years) spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also He made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of GOD's Person( John 10:30 combined with John 5:17), and upholding all things by the Word of His power( Matthew 28:18), when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:
Hallelujah!!!
And Paul Apostle wrote : 2Timothy 3:16-17
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of GOD, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of GOD may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
GOD BLESS
To the only wise GOD our Saviour, be Glory and Majesty, Dominion and Power, both now and ever. Amen.
Jude 1:25
MAN MADE ONLY AS A LIVING SOUL
The Word,GOD Himself,Who is from everlasting to everlasting, self-executing,He has in He Himself the project written since Eternity how to make man in His image,but GOD is Spirit,how could man see the image of His Spirit?It's impossible unless the Spirit be made physically.
The Word-the Word is GOD-GOD is Spirit and a Person,He knew it would be impossible He be known and seen in Spirit,even being a Person in He Himself as Word,so when the time arrived in to make man in His image and likeness,through His invisible Spirit and own Person as manifested Word,two distincts Persons,then He said:Let US make man in OUR image,after our likeness.
The Person of GOD as Word still was in His bosom.The Word had not still been made flesh,then was only a man made of the dust. With the revelation of the Word was given life to the man,through the Word was breathed into the nostrils of man the breath of life; and man became a living soul from the beginning until JESUS.
A MAN MADE AS LIVING SPIRIT-THIS ONLY AFTER JESUS
GOD had planned to make man in His image,but how?once He was Spirit and only One,as whether was alone?First He needed to make an image from He Himself and that's what GOD did with the birth of JESUS.JESUS was born in the turn of the fourth to the fifth Day,in the turn of fourth to the fifth millennium.JESUS was no longer in the bosom of the Father,the Word- Hebrews 1:1-4.
With the birth of JESUS,GOD could fulfill His wonderful promise to make man in His image,a quickning spirit,as planned.From JESUS until now passed more 2000 years,so we are at the turn of the sixth to the seventh and last Day, the Lord's Day,or seventh and last millennium,the millennium of GOD's Kingdom- Revelation 11:15-18,so in fulfillment of what says the Word,the dead shall be raised incorruptible-1 Cor.15:52-, and we that are alive shall be changed- Philippians 3:20-21.
JESUS is the KING of kings - kings made by He Himself - Re.1:8 and 5:10, and LORD of the lords. Michael is a lord, a Prince of GOD. JESUS sent him to the isle of Patmos-Re.1:1. Revelation 22:8-9 clarify: 8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down TO WORSHIP before the feet of the ANGEL which shewed me these things. 9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship GOD.
JESUS is God- Hebrews 1:8, not an angel, nor Archangel. JESUS and Michael are two distincts persons. By the way, Michael the Archangel fought / contended against the Devil when he disputed about the body of Moses (by allegory we may understand Israel was the body of Moses), and now again he shall contend with the old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world, fighting/ disputing about the Body od Christ: now, even now, from now, in the time of Apocalypse, Satan now called red Dragon, he shall be cast out from this current heavenly environment- Ephesians 1:3-8- into the earth, and his messengers shall be also cast out with him.
Michael shall cast Satan into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more.
Be careful or else get ready
as the lightning that cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall the coming of the Son of man be. Get ready- Matthew 25:10-, knowing that only lamp- Psalm 119:105-is not suffice to enter in the kingdom of GOD - Matthew 7:21-27 and Malachi 4:11-14.
Michael the archangel is one like unto the Son of man, the difference is that Michael is a warrior, JESUS the Savior, He is the stone which is become the head of the corner. There is no salvation in any other(except in JESUS Christ):for there is none other NAME under heaven given among men, whereby we MUST be saved.
JESUS/JOSHUA warned: ... no man cometh unto the Father, but by me, so Adonai, Jehovah, YHWH, Yahweh, HaShem, Yehovah, Elohim, Yahusha , YEHshia, YEHvah, ten supposed and fictitious names, better, NICKNAMES of GOD, added in the Jewish Bible, and inadvertently copied into the Gentile Bible by the translators, they all are good for nothing.
Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. But who comes first that will cause to happen Great Tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. My Lord JESUS made it very clear, saying: Except those days (this current time) should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
A false messiah is at door, he will manifest himself soon- Revelation 13:11-14 combined with John 5:43-47-AN IMPOSTOR- , he was born decadas ago, understand? It is he the God of the Jews- 2Thessalonians 2:3-4.
My Lord JESUS warned: If any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; BELEIVE IT NOT.
Be careful and get ready
In response to you request, my Bible is written in Portuguese, translated by Joo Ferreira de Almeida, printed by Imprensa Bblica Brasileira, created in 1940, adding a system of biblical references, and a concise or compact biblical dictionary translated from English by Dr. S.L. Watson and wife, Mrs Ana, former missionaries in Brazil.
I'm from Brazil, I live in the south of Brazil, close to Argentina, now it's 1.05 AM here.
As for the Jewish calendar, I agree with you, saying, "Being a Jew does not make his calendar correct", and That's exactly what I tried to demonstrate in my post yesterday, asking the following question: How to explain the difference of exactly 240 years in the Jewish calendar? In my understanding, I find this difference in the calendar of a genuinely biblical people created and developed by GOD very strange.
So I suggested three specifics events at facts that are a stain on the nation's history of Israel , actually shameful events in the history of Israel as probable causes of the difference between the Jewish calendar and the Biblical Chronology. The three events are:
1-The Jewish Calendar begins in Seth, not in Adam, so we have less 130 years here;
2-Jews do not consider their 40 years of wandering in the desert, from Egypt to the promised land;
3-They do not consider also their shameful 70 years of captivity in Babylon.
What other explanation could there be that would justify this difference of exactly 240 years?
NOTE:Not only their calendar is a nonsense,biblicaly uncorrect,as we all can see,but also a devilish colection of fictitious GOD's NAMES that they added in the Jewish Bible by their esoteric, and kabbalistic and spiritist spirit, even calling GOD's name through four capital letters YHWH or YHVH among other nine pseudo names,which are not named by the Holy Spirit,but by the spirit of the Evil,the Wicked- John 8:44.The true and only NAME of GOD is revealed, for example, in Acts 4:11-13 and Hebrews 1:8.
GOD bless
I work with the Word of GOD, and I have already answered your questions several times.
I work with the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD Himself, don't you understand? Two thousand years ago the Word Himself was made flesh by the NAME of JESUS, yes, by the NAME of JESUS, as He promised to His people through the prophets- Hebrews 1:1-3, as I have said in answering your questions. But you are masked by a pretense, and you pretend have not seen, your lack of interest in the Word of GOD reveals who really dominates your life.
I reapeat. I work with the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD Himself, don't you understand? Why do you not understand my speech? It's because you are unable to hear the true and pure Word of Truth. Your lack of interest in the Word of GOD reveals who dominates you your life.
I repeat. I work with the Word of GOD, and I have already answered your questions several times, but not according your evil and disguised spirit, for the Word of GOD -the Word is GOD Himself- recommends saying: Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you also be like unto him-Prov.26:4. And the Word states that "when the fool speaks pleasantly, believe him not / don't trust him: for there are SEVEN abominations in his heart. And my Lord JESUS clearly revealed, saying: Luke 11:23-24 and 26:
23 He that is not with me is against me: and he that gathereth not with me scattereth.
24 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.
26 Then goeth he, and taketh to him SEVEN other spirits more wicked than himself; and they enter in, and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.
Furthemore, my Lord JESUS left very clear, saying: John 12:47-48:
If any man hear my words, and believe not, I Judge him not: for I came not to Judge the world, but to save the world. But already hath one that Judgeth him:...
Get ready
You called God "(Theos); Father (Patter;Abba-more intimate); Lord(Kurios), well, by the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD, you are saying nothing, your testimony about GOD in your post is irrelevant, insignificant, it was not by the Spirit of Christ, and it was not by the Spirit of Truth and John 16:12-15 confirm / endorse what I am just saying. Unfortunately you keep snaking in devilish doctrines and tares sowed by the Wicked one. --> By the way, "It is GOD that sitteth upon the circle of the Earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers- Isaiah 40:22. Indeed, this revelation which GOD did give to Isaiah explains or suggests why there is not Life in whole Universe except in the Earth, I mean out of the Earth there is not in whole Universe the variety of Life that there is in the Earth, because GOD is sat upon the circle of the Earth.
To finish, you have cited in your posts the NAME of GOD as being the esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist JEHOVAH, YAHWEH, YHWH, ADONAI, EL SHADAI, HaSHEM, so I quoted John 17:6 where my Lord JESUS in His prayer said to the Father that He had MANIFESTED His NAME to the MEN that He, GOD the Father, had given to Him, So I asked UNTO you: What is the GOD's NAME my Lord JESUS MANIFESTED to the men?
Now, now, from your knowledge you said here the names mentioned above are NAMES of GOD, so I wanted to know which of these NAMES of GOD my Lord JESUS would have manifested to the men? The question is mine, not yours, I'm waiting you response.
Be careful or else get ready
You asked, "what GOD's NAME was manifested by my Lord JESUS?" Yet, reading the rest of your comments, it appears to me that you hold to an "only Jesus is in Heaven" position, that when Jesus was made flesh, "GOD called Himself Jesus.." Really!!! So, as not to be mistaken, are you in that camp, that says 'that since God is in Christ that only Jesus is now in Heaven'? I'm hoping that I've misunderstood you, as we know most assuredly that when Jesus ascended into Heaven, He went back to the Father & is seated at His right Hand ( John 20:17, Acts 2:32,33, Romans 8:34, Hebrews 1:3, 1 Peter 3:22, etc.). So, NOT two Gods, but the One God, with Jesus His Son Who came forth out of God now distinct from Him through the incarnation. Thus He rightly fully claims the eternity of the Godhead (the Alpha & Omega), & also receives the worship of all. So your comments are troubling, if that is your position.
It is true Ronald, that most of those Scriptures you've cited certainly show that there is only One God & none else. I can wholeheartedly agree with that belief, that we together share in.
You also mentioned the Holy Spirit. Without introducing the Holy Spirit into this thread but for the sake of comparison & meditation, I'm sure you wouldn't deny that God sent out His Spirit to accomplish His Work in the World & in hearts ( John 16:7-11, & others). How can God send out His Spirit, & yet be Who He is, without being grossly deficient in His Being? Is God now Spirit-less since the Holy Spirit has been sent into the World & how can the Spirit also be dissected into millions of 'parts' (Spirits), filling each true believer with Himself, i.e. with God's Presence in them? Likewise, if God can do so with His Spirit & still be Spirit Himself, & this is a mystery to us, can He not also do so with His Word? Does this leave God devoid of knowledge, speech or thought, because He sent out His Word first by the prophets, then in & through His Son? ( Hebrews 1:1-3). The difference here now is, this Word was not just a spoken Word, but the "Word was made flesh". We couldn't say this, nor have read that any prophet of the OT, having received the Word, was made flesh.
With the many Scriptures that have already been given, I find it very reasonable to believe that this Word was treated just as God did with His Spirit. God sent out His Word in the olden days via His prophets, but the time had come when His Word would be sent out in His Son. If all we had was the account in Matthew 1:20-25 that Mary gave birth to a special Son, from the Holy Seed of God, then yes, this appearance of this One called Emmanuel & Jesus, was indeed a fresh creation by God to bring out His Word, not just in speech form, but in demonstration of the Holiness of God, His Power, His Love, & ultimately, His Sacrifice. Onto Page 2.
Part one,
As I said I am not the best in explaining my understanding and I will try, I feel you deserve it, for you have been gracious to even discuss this with me.
1 Corinthians 15:47 This is after Jesus was raised from the dead and Paul is saying our Lord. First the earthy the first Adam then the spiritual the last Adam Jesus who did come from heaven when Jesus, God's Son was conceived in Mary's womb.
We see in Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Jesus defeated death because He was without sin the firstborn from the dead the only man who lived a perfect life. After He was baptized and anointed God gave Him authority John 5:26-27.
Matthew 1:20 Acts 17:31 Rev. 12:5 My understanding is the preexistence of Jesus was in God's plan before anything was created. A man caused sin to enter mankind and it had to be a man to live a perfect life to fulfill and make void the law, God could not do that.
Hebrews 1:5 Jesus is not a God there is only one true God, Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. a man who is God's Son conceived in Mary, who God raised in a glorified body and placed Him on His right side on His throne above all that is in heaven and earth and under the earth.
See part two.
1 Corinthians 15:24-28; Philippians 2:9: yes, as a Son, Jesus is now subject to His Father & is exalted above all. Yet, the question remains unanswered, 'Who was Jesus prior to His Coming?' He wasn't called Jesus (though some believe in Christophany-type appearances in the OT), but the Scriptures, as I gave earlier, point to Him coming forth from within God.
1 Peter 1:19-21: "If Jesus pre-existed how could he be foreordained?" Jesus was foreordained before His coming to Earth - that was God's Plan & Purpose for redemption. But this verse tells us that Jesus was in God's Plan, but it doesn't speak of where Jesus came from at the beginning; this One Who from God, had framed the worlds ( Hebrews 1:2). I would think it nonsense if any would believe that Jesus, after His appearing, then ascended to the Father, & then made the worlds.
Rather than listing the Scriptures that show Jesus in the Flesh & returning to His Father triumphant (which we all agree to), we need to focus on whether the Scriptures show that He had a beginning before His earthly appearance - and these I gave which have not been addressed. Anyway, we'll leave it for now, as per your wish brother, but if any other 'non-trinitarian' wishes to continue this & specifically to exegete the Scriptures I gave earlier, then I will continue with it, as it is a most important doctrine to understand. Blessings.
Page 1.
Thanks again Ronald, and I note that you would like a recess on this discussion. But if I might briefly address the Scriptures you shared & why I believe that they don't answer the question, 'was Jesus' first appearance only from the womb of Mary, or did He exist in another Form within the Person of God?'
To your references:
1 Corinthians 15:47: "the second man is the Lord from Heaven" (not a Man Who became Lord, Who went into Heaven & then returned to Earth as Lord from Heaven - but the Lord Who was in Heaven & came to Earth, unlike the first man, Adam, Who was created from the Earth & back to the Earth he went).
1 Timothy 2:5: yes, Jesus is the Mediator now between God & mankind after His ascension.
Matthew 1:20, Acts 17:31, Revelation 12:5: yes again, all point to Jesus as a Man/Babe Who came from God - but no direct reference to any previous existence.
Hebrews 1:5: indeed, Jesus became the Son of God by virtue of this miraculous Birth, but then God would have created another god, because 'all the angels of God are to worship Him'; & none can receive worship but God alone. You asked, "How could God say I will be to him a Father and he shall be to me a Son if Jesus eternally existed with the Father?" Because God took His Word & gave Flesh to that Word, and this Flesh was brought into the World by the Work of God, which made this One called Jesus, God's Son. Jesus only became the Son of God at the Incarnation.
Hebrews 2:7: Jesus was made "a little lower than the angels" by virtue of His Humanity. It seems there is an order of created beings before God: the angels being above humanity, of which Jesus was made, thus subjecting Him to being our equal.
Onto Page 2.