Yes we are assigned to wrath...As Jesus said every sinner will have his part in the lake of fire....Which is his baptism of the H.G. and FIRE....The only way his vengence ( his wrath ) can be satisfied is by the lake of fire....His wrath is his love whom the lord loveth he chastens.... Hebrews 12 :8...If ye be without chastisement then are ye bastards and not sons....But we cannot tell ppl we are not assigned to wrath....When ye say things like that you are in essence saying we don't need his baptism of the H.G. AND FIRE...Nor his lake of fire....Jesus said every sinner MUST have his part in the lake of FIRE....Which is his baptism of the H.G. and fire.....Then and only then are we made free from his wrath....YA GOT TO RIGHTY DIVIDE THE WORD OF GOD
Whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire...Our names are written in the book of life when we are baptised with the H.G. and fire...That New BIRTH IS WHEN His wrath is satisfied when we are washed in his blood... That NEW Covenant in his blood is the book of life....Simply b/c he wrote this book with his own blood....
Behold i send the Promise of my father upon you... Luke 24:49...Which was baptism of the H.G. AND FIRE.....The only thing that satisfies his wrath....We cannot do away with his baptism of the H.G. and fire.....Thats y he is saying every sinner has to have his part in the lake of fire....As our God is a consuming fire that has to consume our old evil adamic nature....
Jesus is a man of war...there is vengence in his heart... Psalms 55:21....Thus his wrath....His words were softer then oil but war was in his heart and his words were smother then butter but they were as drawn swords....Thus we see that there is war in his heart...Vengence ...thus wrath....But whom the lord loveth he chastens....Thus his wrath is his love for humanity...But if there was no wrath no, No chastisement then we wd be bastards and not sons... Hebrews 12:10....
So we should definitely be prayerful asking for stronger faith and the will to stand in the day of trouble. I read a good article from Corrie Ten Boom (from the 70's) about believing that God will help us do this. She was living proof of this as she survived captivity in a concentration camp under Hitler.
She was a believer who hid Jews, was captured along with her sister, and put in the camp.
She recalls the stacks of dead bodies that accumulated daily in the camp. Her sister was one of them. But her faith stood in the time of trouble.
She also spoke of traveling around the world meeting up with Christians in places like China and Africa where thousands and thousands of Christians were routinely martyred by the Chinese government of the time and in African countries. This happened all over the world and still continues.
Those of us in western countries have had it pretty good in comparison. But the time may come that we, too, may be the ones martyred or held in captivity. We should be preparing ourselves for such a time, memorizing the Scriptures because we may no longer have our Bibles with us, being faithful in prayer, and be aware of what is happening in world events.
It is not pleasant to think about these things and the temptation to desire an easy way out (such as the pre-trib rapture) can therefore be persuasive. But Scripture refutes this theory, and therefore it is false and dangerous.
Agreed, those who participate in church assemblies are not all at the same place in their walk with the Lord. Some are truly of the faith. Some are mature believers. Others are quite newly reborn. Some are searching. Others on the verge of being saved. Others may be in an assembly all of their lives and appear to be saved but never are.
We should be prayerful of the assembly God has placed us in, praying for those we know there, those that are new to the fellowship, those we know are caught up in sinful ways, and for our pastor and leaders.
Only God truly knows the heart and future of each person who comes into a fellowship. We should be welcoming and genuinely care about those God brings into our sphere of friends. We also need to be available to make new friends and serve God by being a godly guide to those God adds to our sphere.
There will also be those who do not fellowship in a church setting, as David seems to be. And we should love them and extend fellowship to them, too, as we do on here.
The true church of God is, as you say, and invisible congregation that God knows and has elected. We should be thankful that He determines who will be called and elected, not us. We would fail so miserably in our present sinful condition despite being saved and indwelt.
I know many in church fellowships that are sincere believers who serve the Lord obediently in these fellowships. I know pastors that administer their office faithfully. So we cannot put everyone in churches nor every fellowship in the same basket of reprobates as David has done. Jesus said He will build His church. Paul and the apostles established church fellowships in the cities they preached according to the lead of the Holy Spirit. I believe that this is the primary way Jesus build his church.
There may be a time when the apostasy is so great that true believers may need to "come out" of the congregations. But I don't think this is necessarily the time of that.
Dear Rick, I have often wondered the same thing. Aaron was chosen by God to be the High Priest for the Israelites. He failed in making the golden calf. But we are not told why God did not take Aaron's life along with the others. But it may be that He was especially chosen to lead with Moses that his life was spared. Aaron's grave sin was not going to prevail over God's purpose for him in that time in the wilderness.
Jane, You have been seduced by false doctrine. There is no lillith and there was no sex in the garden of eden. These are doctrines of devils to seduce people to believe lies. You need to repent of any sin and I pray if you have an unclean spirit it come out of you in the name of Jesus. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. May god the father reveal the truth to you through the power of his holy spirit. God please deliver Jane from these lies. These are vile and filthy lies from satan and I rebuke them in the name of Jesus Christ.
Consider that the KJV uses the word sleep for being dead awaiting Christ's return.
"Consider and hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death;" Psalms 13:3 KJV
"For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him." 1 Thessalonians 4:14 KJV
"These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep." John 11:11 KJV
"Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 KJV
"And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed." Romans 13:11 KJV
The Bible talks about a "day" of judgment, rather than people being judged sporadically.
"Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world." 1 John 4:17 KJV
And it says no one escapes judgment- people often think they skip this for some reason despite what the Bible says:
"For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad." 2 Corinthians 5:10 KJV
So, when these verses are put together it seems like all will be judged on the same day (also consistent with the vision in Revelation) and that people won't go to heaven until they're first judged, and it then makes sense where it says the dead will rise to meet Jesus in the air. So, to me it all seems logical, what happens. Despite all this evidence in God's word, many people still prefer to believe something else that makes them feel good, however.
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Yes i have a comment about the restrainer the Tare, Satan's seed that wants to restrain the H.G. the wheat a baby Christ from bringing in the Kingdom....That was the very purpose of sowing the good seed in mans hearts that the Kingdom wd be born in us....The H.G. That Child of Promise But here comes satan with his demonic seed....Thus the restrainer is the Tare that wants to destroy the good seed...Paul refers to the Tare as another man in my members....Bringing me into captivity unto sin which is in my members....which is the Tare....Paul was involved in a warfare....The H.G. was the wheat a baby Christ....But the Tare wants to destroy the wheat....Thats y we must endure unto the end to be saved...The Wheat is a baby Christ simply b/c the sower of that good seed is Christ the bridegroom....And the Tare is a baby Satan...The restrainer ...Remember the dragon wanted to kill the woman and her Child...In Rev 12:10....But in the end he is killed, the dragon is satans seed....Now Paul refers to the Tare as a thorn in the flesh....But it was actually a Tare satan's seed....That was trying to restrain the Kingdom from coming to the man born again by this good seed....A kingdom seed....That incorruptible seed .....Its Kingdom against Kingdom as our lord said....He knew that we wd be involved in a warfare....And the avenger is satans seed....Unless you receive the Kingdom AS A LIL CHILD.
Rev.22:11 Tells us about the 2 seeds as the Tares and the wheat....One is always filthy and evil but 1 is always holy and righteous.....And this war is raging within us....Thats y Paul was saying when i wd do good evil is present with me....With my mind i serve the law of God but with my flesh the TARE ( his thorn in the flesh ) I SERVE THE LAW OF SIN....Thats y God cd not remove it....Thus we must endure to the end....When the Tares are gathered and burned....Then the wheat the Children of the Kingdom will reign with Christ.
Wasn't Aaron more guilty than anyone else in this instance for making the golden calf as a god? Please help me understand how Aaron should not have been slain with the others who worshipped at the alter that Aaron built for this golden calf.
This is such an encouraging verse in God's word! This world is oftentimes so discouraging and the work of the Lord can become quite heavy and feel as if there is no reward in it.
I am so thankful God reminds us here that our work for Him WILL be rewarded! He is surely a God that understands our infirmities and our struggles!
So thankful to be one of His chosen ones! Thankful that He knows ALL! Thank you, LORD, for loving us so kindly and reminding us that our labour is not in vain!
When God is not answering our prayers there are a couple of things that might be going on. First, we are likely asking amiss, meaning we are asking outside of God's will. We are asking within our own will. James 4:3 says Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
God's ways are higher than our ways and God's thoughts are higher than our thoughts. We are finite and cannot see the entire picture but God can!
Secondly, we can hinder our prayer life with unconfessed sins. Psalms 66:18 says If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:
Isaiah 59:2 says But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
These are two reasons that prayers are not answered...The first is in my opinion more often than the latter...
Another reason is...it is simply just not time yet! We always have to remember everything is in God's perfect timing! Not in our timing as I said previously, we cannot see the whole picture but God can!
So continue to pray and ask the Holy Ghost to lead you in your prayers or maybe just simply ask if your prayer is really within God's will.
God's unanswered prayers are sometimes His greatest blessings!
Can someone please explain , Matthew chapter 17 verse 11 ? Jesus appears to be speaking of a future event , but then in verse 12 he says that Elias is come already . Thanks in anticipation .
so there was 42 generations from Abram to CHRIST .2. things i want to know ,how long was it from Adam to Abram? 2. how long from Christ to the present?
Can anyone please tell me what book has the devine order in it please. I know the dead in Christ will rise first & 7 yr Tribulation is after we are taken up to meet Jesus (not His 2nd coming) in clouds yet the rest is fuzzy & I can't find it. Thank you.
Thanks for responding. From a big picture perspective the true gospel is not about the political nations of the world in any sense. Although God is certainly concerned about everything that happens on this planet, and that includes the political nations. But not in respect to the gospel. The gospel is concerned about the spiritual warfare that exists between the kingdom of God and the kingdom of Satan. And that is a spiritual warfare, and has nothing to do with political nations.
That said, the Nation of Israel was God's corporate representation of His kingdom during the Old Testament time beginning with Abraham. Just like the New Testament church was the corporate representation of God's kingdom during the church age.
Unfortunately, some want to make the gospel, a social gospel, or a political gospel.
The true gospel is the declaration of our terrible condition and situation before God, because of our sin and rebellion. And the incomprehensible mercy of God, at tremendous cost to himself, of providing a solution and unimaginably blessed inheritance for those whom He saves.
And it seems that some on this forum disapprove and criticize that I have researched a movement that isn't found in the Bible, but in recent church history. Why would they do this? Perhaps because one who investigates theories and belief systems may be able to shed some light on this theory that they do not wish to be exposed or maybe they are concerned that posting information from honest investigation may lead some away from dispensationalism. But I don't know really the reason I get so much negative remarks from some on here.
I do not criticize how others learn on here, but I do speak to what people do say with my responses. I do think that some may be taken aback by some of us, like you, me, Jimbob, who strongly disagree with dispensational tenets and also strongly hold to our post-Trib coming of Jesus. It seems that maybe they feel that their strong adherence to their beliefs from dispensationalism should just be accepted at face value and not be challenged. I think the cloth cuts both ways and those of us who step up to post should be willing to have their IDEA challenged w/o degrading opponents character, spiritual walk or maturity.
But I know that these topics are ones that dispensationalists feel very sensitive about. This is why I have not responded every time eschatology is presented on this forum. But I do post at times just to show that there are other viewpoints that contradict the dispensational viewpoint and to support others like you and Jimbob. I am pretty tough and can take criticism, but I will speak up when I think some critical statements are unfair or out of line.
Keep us the good work of taking every thought captive to the word of God, as I do, an many others on here do, too. It is so important to pray and allow the Holy Spirit to develop in each of us the mind of Christ . By doing so, we will know that truth that is only in Him and rightly interpret Scripture and have the freedom to search for better understanding.
-Jesus will reign during the millennium on the physical throne of David in Jerusalem as Israel is the top nation in the world
-Israel and millennium saints will be resurrected at the end of the millenium
-there will be mortal people living on the earth during the millennium who will procreate, live a long life, and die.
-Jesus came initially for the Jews, not for the Gentiles (some believe this ) so the Gospels are not "to" Gentile believers as far as applying directly to our lives
-There are unfulfilled promises God made to the Israelites concerning possessing all the lands promised
-God will fulfill these outstanding promises in the millennium
-Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles and the other apostles were only for the Jews (some believe this)
-the to was applied to Israel only, not to Gentile believers (some believe this).
-only the Epistles of Paul apply to directly to Gentile believers (some believe this)
-other epistles and the Gospels are directed to the Jews only, so they do not apply to us Gentile believers (some believe this)
-that dispensational applications to Bible interpretation are the true way to "rightly divide the Scripture" (some believe this)
I know that there are probably many more beliefs peculiar to dispensationalist, but these are the ones I have read represented on this forum.
I am hard pressed to find firm biblical support for any of these tenets of dispensationalism. To me, they are all pre-conceived assumptions and speculation superimposed onto the Scriptures . This system uses selective Scripture verses that are twisted and added to to fit their belief system, not having the Scripture form one's beliefs first and foremost.
So, since I have just recently learned of these beliefs, I have endeavored to learn more about them, how they came to be, through whom they were promulgated, what was the background of these promulgators, how they were disseminated and reinforced over time, etc.
David, Amen to that. We want to have the mind of Christ concerning our approach to Scripture interpretation and end times beliefs. When I read in the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John what Jesus said about His second coming when asked by His disciples, He never once spoke of a pre-trib rapture. If this was true, He would have reassured the disciples that they would be rescued by Him prior to the Tribulation that was sure to come at the end of time. But He did not. He said repeatedly that those who endure to the end will be saved.
I, too, only knew of the pre-trib rapture doctrine (which I heard in my early 20's). It seemed a possibility then, but the more I read on the end times I soon came to reject this teaching because I could not find it mentioned of supported in Scripture anywhere. And from there, I believed what Jesus said in the Gospels concerning His return.
It wasn't until I came on this site a year or so ago that I was exposed to dispensationalism that ingterpreted that:
- the 70th weeks of Daniel was not fulfilled and is to be fulfilled during the 7 year tribulation.
-that God put a "pause" in the prophetic clock at the 69th week
-that Jesus offered the earthly kingdom to the Jews but they rejected it and HIm
-therefore, God went to plan B: Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection to save both Jews and Gentiles who believe
-the church age is part of plan B
- there is a distinction between Israel and the church and it needs to remain so as a separation for the rest of history
-the church will be raptured pre-tribulation (resurrected NT saints and Christian believers only)
-the Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth with the rapture of the Church
-the Tribulation begins the prophetic clock again for the 70th week to be fulfilled
-the Tribulation saints will be resurrected at the end of the Tribulation
-Israel will be the predominant nation in the world with renewal of the sacrificial system and all peoples will live by the OT
Because of what I'm saying about the churches of our day, I want to provide what I see from my own personal experience as well as what I have learned from others about church history and particularly the last 50-75 years or so. I am old enough to have observed some of this. Let me say emphatically that my observations and experience should never be a basis for scriptural interpretation in any sense. We can interpret our observations and experience from scripture. Never the other way around.
We can see from scripture that the church even very quickly after the cross began to depart somewhat from truth. We read this in Galatians and in the seven churches in Rev 2 and Rev 3. The Bible speaks for itself regarding this.
The church had gone very much astray by the time of the Reformation, when God raised up faithful men like Luther, Calvin, Knox and others along with the invention of the printing press that made Bibles available to the masses. Many of the Creeds and Confessions that define post-reformation churches and denominations were developed at that time and made giant steps toward correcting some of the false teachings prevalent in that day. But they were not infallible.
Unfortunately up until and including our day, very little in-depth Bible study and questioning by the churches of those Confessions has been done. And even worse, they came to have an authority in the churches equal to or more so than the Bible itself. But despite all this, God was very patient and longsuffering with the churches in continuing to use them as His primary means of getting the Gospel out into the world.
Today, however, if we examine what the churches are doing and teaching we find that the Bible has essentially lost its authority as we see activities and teachings within the churches that would never have been tolerated 50-75 years ago. And virtually every church teaches a do-it-yourself Gospel where WE need to DO something to become saved.
1 Timothy 6:9 talks about traps which "drown men in perdition." Let us consider for a moment how things will stand after the Rapture of the Church (assuming of course in a Pre-Trib rapture viewpoint). Before we tangle with what seems to be an impossible situation for those remaining on the earth to believe what just happened is anything other than calling His saints home to glory; let us rewind back to the time of Christ. In this time there clearly were many miracles which could only be attributed logically to God. (see John 9:32 and the healing of the blind man). Nonetheless; Satan (or Beelzebub which is a reference to an equally evil entity) was attributed to such things by the blind Pharisees. ( Matthew 12:22). This was despite the obvious fulfillment of prophecies which pertained to Christ from the Old Testament; not to mention his own prophetic warnings of crucifixion to come as well as the Resurrection seen by 500 ( 1 Cor. 15:1-11). Such hatred shows the blindness of the minds of men by the god of this world ( 2 Cor. 4:4); as well as our own state apart from the illumination of the Holy Spirit to such matters.
So looking ahead to the beginning of the Tribulation; we should expect more of the same. Evil will be unrestrained at that time unlike any time before or since ( Matt. 24:21). Since all but 8 died in Noah's flood; we expect therefore that the demons being loosened will be the thing making things worse since a number actually will physically survive to the end. A short inspection of the media today should clearly indicate how entrenched images of occult and Satanic worship has become acceptable to the mainstream. When we see undeniable and verifiable signs such as fire coming down from heaven that the False Prophet performs; it is no surprise the world embraces it; and worships the image (as well as likely creating it themselves perhaps on their own computers).
IT seems that with the downplay (if even being a factor at all) of coming to saving faith of repentance for individuals another issue is being unwilling to confront national evils which we are called to sound out against as per Ezekiel 33. There are several reasons for this; one being fear of societal disapproval or persecution; going against the grain of many who are rather lukewarm about the subject and the most insidious perhaps being our own tendancy to be overcomfortable as the pot approaches boiling as we see in the case of Lot. James 5:3 should be carefully read; as many think that through their own efforts they can make it through the Tribulation; or even be able to endure things before that should there be a crash in the metals market; or perhaps something else such as nuclear fallout that could render such wealth useless. There needs to be a healthy balance between wise prudence in resources and hoarding; the former being ideally used for other saints in a time of crisis as was in the book of Acts; and the latter being a tendency to fall into based on political persuasion being set above spiritual wisdom.
As with my first part in this series; it should be obvious that the crap will hit the fan; so to speak. Or; as I put it God is much more longsuffering than I am; considering the long list of abominations our own nation has committed; although hardly alone in such actions we have been the catalyst for expanding these horrors worldwide (abortion; pornography; illicit drug trade).
Whether we are Babylon or not; or a part of the final world system it is evident that destruction when it comes will be so speedy that there is no remedy to avoid the famine; plagues; war and demonic infestation of the earth at that time short of Divine Intervention and protection.
Satan will have his day in the spotlight; so let us work while it still is day. ( John 9:4).
But, if you are aware of these churches that teach differently than what is written in Matthew 28:19, go to them amd
share with them the truth.
1Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
Whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire...Our names are written in the book of life when we are baptised with the H.G. and fire...That New BIRTH IS WHEN His wrath is satisfied when we are washed in his blood... That NEW Covenant in his blood is the book of life....Simply b/c he wrote this book with his own blood....
Behold i send the Promise of my father upon you... Luke 24:49...Which was baptism of the H.G. AND FIRE.....The only thing that satisfies his wrath....We cannot do away with his baptism of the H.G. and fire.....Thats y he is saying every sinner has to have his part in the lake of fire....As our God is a consuming fire that has to consume our old evil adamic nature....
Jesus is a man of war...there is vengence in his heart... Psalms 55:21....Thus his wrath....His words were softer then oil but war was in his heart and his words were smother then butter but they were as drawn swords....Thus we see that there is war in his heart...Vengence ...thus wrath....But whom the lord loveth he chastens....Thus his wrath is his love for humanity...But if there was no wrath no, No chastisement then we wd be bastards and not sons... Hebrews 12:10....
PROPHECY:
Ezekiel 36:27 And I will put my spirit WITHIN YOU, and CAUSE YOU to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep MY JUDGEMENTS, and DO THEM.
You DIED with Christ, YOU WERE RAISED with Christ, this is the POWER OF THE RESURRECTION.
You are now the BODY of Christ, everything you say, will to do, or do is CAUSED by the spirit of TRUTH and LIFE WITHIN YOU.
Very FEW BELIEVE God's word.
Philippians 2:13 For it is God (spirit) which WORKETH IN YOU, both TO WILL and TO DO his good pleasure.
Colossians 1:27 ....this mystery .....Christ in you .....
Matthew 7:14 ...narrow is THE WAY .....FEW there be that FIND IT ....
John 14:6 ....I AM THE WAY .......
1 Corinthians 12:27 ...Ye are the BODY OF CHRIST .....
FEW BELIEVE God's word.
Psalms 82:6 I (God himself) HAVE SAID, ye are gods, the children of the most high.
Your the dwelling place of GOD, your are doing the very will of God 24/7.
The question is? Do you believe God's word?
God Bless YOU, as our Father brings us to TRUTH.
Yes I do, too.
So we should definitely be prayerful asking for stronger faith and the will to stand in the day of trouble. I read a good article from Corrie Ten Boom (from the 70's) about believing that God will help us do this. She was living proof of this as she survived captivity in a concentration camp under Hitler.
She was a believer who hid Jews, was captured along with her sister, and put in the camp.
She recalls the stacks of dead bodies that accumulated daily in the camp. Her sister was one of them. But her faith stood in the time of trouble.
She also spoke of traveling around the world meeting up with Christians in places like China and Africa where thousands and thousands of Christians were routinely martyred by the Chinese government of the time and in African countries. This happened all over the world and still continues.
Those of us in western countries have had it pretty good in comparison. But the time may come that we, too, may be the ones martyred or held in captivity. We should be preparing ourselves for such a time, memorizing the Scriptures because we may no longer have our Bibles with us, being faithful in prayer, and be aware of what is happening in world events.
It is not pleasant to think about these things and the temptation to desire an easy way out (such as the pre-trib rapture) can therefore be persuasive. But Scripture refutes this theory, and therefore it is false and dangerous.
Agreed, those who participate in church assemblies are not all at the same place in their walk with the Lord. Some are truly of the faith. Some are mature believers. Others are quite newly reborn. Some are searching. Others on the verge of being saved. Others may be in an assembly all of their lives and appear to be saved but never are.
We should be prayerful of the assembly God has placed us in, praying for those we know there, those that are new to the fellowship, those we know are caught up in sinful ways, and for our pastor and leaders.
Only God truly knows the heart and future of each person who comes into a fellowship. We should be welcoming and genuinely care about those God brings into our sphere of friends. We also need to be available to make new friends and serve God by being a godly guide to those God adds to our sphere.
There will also be those who do not fellowship in a church setting, as David seems to be. And we should love them and extend fellowship to them, too, as we do on here.
The true church of God is, as you say, and invisible congregation that God knows and has elected. We should be thankful that He determines who will be called and elected, not us. We would fail so miserably in our present sinful condition despite being saved and indwelt.
I know many in church fellowships that are sincere believers who serve the Lord obediently in these fellowships. I know pastors that administer their office faithfully. So we cannot put everyone in churches nor every fellowship in the same basket of reprobates as David has done. Jesus said He will build His church. Paul and the apostles established church fellowships in the cities they preached according to the lead of the Holy Spirit. I believe that this is the primary way Jesus build his church.
There may be a time when the apostasy is so great that true believers may need to "come out" of the congregations. But I don't think this is necessarily the time of that.
Consider that the KJV uses the word sleep for being dead awaiting Christ's return.
"Consider and hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death;" Psalms 13:3 KJV
"For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him." 1 Thessalonians 4:14 KJV
"These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep." John 11:11 KJV
"Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 KJV
"And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed." Romans 13:11 KJV
The Bible talks about a "day" of judgment, rather than people being judged sporadically.
"Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world." 1 John 4:17 KJV
And it says no one escapes judgment- people often think they skip this for some reason despite what the Bible says:
"For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad." 2 Corinthians 5:10 KJV
So, when these verses are put together it seems like all will be judged on the same day (also consistent with the vision in Revelation) and that people won't go to heaven until they're first judged, and it then makes sense where it says the dead will rise to meet Jesus in the air. So, to me it all seems logical, what happens. Despite all this evidence in God's word, many people still prefer to believe something else that makes them feel good, however.
My question: What is the will of the Father?
Or do we stay in the grave until Jesus 's
Return?????
Rev.22:11 Tells us about the 2 seeds as the Tares and the wheat....One is always filthy and evil but 1 is always holy and righteous.....And this war is raging within us....Thats y Paul was saying when i wd do good evil is present with me....With my mind i serve the law of God but with my flesh the TARE ( his thorn in the flesh ) I SERVE THE LAW OF SIN....Thats y God cd not remove it....Thus we must endure to the end....When the Tares are gathered and burned....Then the wheat the Children of the Kingdom will reign with Christ.
Rev 12:5, Rev 22:11
Romans 7 :23
I am so thankful God reminds us here that our work for Him WILL be rewarded! He is surely a God that understands our infirmities and our struggles!
So thankful to be one of His chosen ones! Thankful that He knows ALL! Thank you, LORD, for loving us so kindly and reminding us that our labour is not in vain!
When God is not answering our prayers there are a couple of things that might be going on. First, we are likely asking amiss, meaning we are asking outside of God's will. We are asking within our own will. James 4:3 says Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
God's ways are higher than our ways and God's thoughts are higher than our thoughts. We are finite and cannot see the entire picture but God can!
Secondly, we can hinder our prayer life with unconfessed sins. Psalms 66:18 says If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:
Isaiah 59:2 says But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
These are two reasons that prayers are not answered...The first is in my opinion more often than the latter...
Another reason is...it is simply just not time yet! We always have to remember everything is in God's perfect timing! Not in our timing as I said previously, we cannot see the whole picture but God can!
So continue to pray and ask the Holy Ghost to lead you in your prayers or maybe just simply ask if your prayer is really within God's will.
God's unanswered prayers are sometimes His greatest blessings!
Thanks for responding. From a big picture perspective the true gospel is not about the political nations of the world in any sense. Although God is certainly concerned about everything that happens on this planet, and that includes the political nations. But not in respect to the gospel. The gospel is concerned about the spiritual warfare that exists between the kingdom of God and the kingdom of Satan. And that is a spiritual warfare, and has nothing to do with political nations.
That said, the Nation of Israel was God's corporate representation of His kingdom during the Old Testament time beginning with Abraham. Just like the New Testament church was the corporate representation of God's kingdom during the church age.
Unfortunately, some want to make the gospel, a social gospel, or a political gospel.
The true gospel is the declaration of our terrible condition and situation before God, because of our sin and rebellion. And the incomprehensible mercy of God, at tremendous cost to himself, of providing a solution and unimaginably blessed inheritance for those whom He saves.
Pt. 3
And it seems that some on this forum disapprove and criticize that I have researched a movement that isn't found in the Bible, but in recent church history. Why would they do this? Perhaps because one who investigates theories and belief systems may be able to shed some light on this theory that they do not wish to be exposed or maybe they are concerned that posting information from honest investigation may lead some away from dispensationalism. But I don't know really the reason I get so much negative remarks from some on here.
I do not criticize how others learn on here, but I do speak to what people do say with my responses. I do think that some may be taken aback by some of us, like you, me, Jimbob, who strongly disagree with dispensational tenets and also strongly hold to our post-Trib coming of Jesus. It seems that maybe they feel that their strong adherence to their beliefs from dispensationalism should just be accepted at face value and not be challenged. I think the cloth cuts both ways and those of us who step up to post should be willing to have their IDEA challenged w/o degrading opponents character, spiritual walk or maturity.
But I know that these topics are ones that dispensationalists feel very sensitive about. This is why I have not responded every time eschatology is presented on this forum. But I do post at times just to show that there are other viewpoints that contradict the dispensational viewpoint and to support others like you and Jimbob. I am pretty tough and can take criticism, but I will speak up when I think some critical statements are unfair or out of line.
Keep us the good work of taking every thought captive to the word of God, as I do, an many others on here do, too. It is so important to pray and allow the Holy Spirit to develop in each of us the mind of Christ . By doing so, we will know that truth that is only in Him and rightly interpret Scripture and have the freedom to search for better understanding.
cont.
-Jesus will reign during the millennium on the physical throne of David in Jerusalem as Israel is the top nation in the world
-Israel and millennium saints will be resurrected at the end of the millenium
-there will be mortal people living on the earth during the millennium who will procreate, live a long life, and die.
-Jesus came initially for the Jews, not for the Gentiles (some believe this ) so the Gospels are not "to" Gentile believers as far as applying directly to our lives
-There are unfulfilled promises God made to the Israelites concerning possessing all the lands promised
-God will fulfill these outstanding promises in the millennium
-Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles and the other apostles were only for the Jews (some believe this)
-the to was applied to Israel only, not to Gentile believers (some believe this).
-only the Epistles of Paul apply to directly to Gentile believers (some believe this)
-other epistles and the Gospels are directed to the Jews only, so they do not apply to us Gentile believers (some believe this)
-that dispensational applications to Bible interpretation are the true way to "rightly divide the Scripture" (some believe this)
I know that there are probably many more beliefs peculiar to dispensationalist, but these are the ones I have read represented on this forum.
I am hard pressed to find firm biblical support for any of these tenets of dispensationalism. To me, they are all pre-conceived assumptions and speculation superimposed onto the Scriptures . This system uses selective Scripture verses that are twisted and added to to fit their belief system, not having the Scripture form one's beliefs first and foremost.
So, since I have just recently learned of these beliefs, I have endeavored to learn more about them, how they came to be, through whom they were promulgated, what was the background of these promulgators, how they were disseminated and reinforced over time, etc.
cont.
I, too, only knew of the pre-trib rapture doctrine (which I heard in my early 20's). It seemed a possibility then, but the more I read on the end times I soon came to reject this teaching because I could not find it mentioned of supported in Scripture anywhere. And from there, I believed what Jesus said in the Gospels concerning His return.
It wasn't until I came on this site a year or so ago that I was exposed to dispensationalism that ingterpreted that:
- the 70th weeks of Daniel was not fulfilled and is to be fulfilled during the 7 year tribulation.
-that God put a "pause" in the prophetic clock at the 69th week
-that Jesus offered the earthly kingdom to the Jews but they rejected it and HIm
-therefore, God went to plan B: Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection to save both Jews and Gentiles who believe
-the church age is part of plan B
- there is a distinction between Israel and the church and it needs to remain so as a separation for the rest of history
-the church will be raptured pre-tribulation (resurrected NT saints and Christian believers only)
-the Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth with the rapture of the Church
-the Tribulation begins the prophetic clock again for the 70th week to be fulfilled
-the Tribulation saints will be resurrected at the end of the Tribulation
-Israel will be the predominant nation in the world with renewal of the sacrificial system and all peoples will live by the OT
We can see from scripture that the church even very quickly after the cross began to depart somewhat from truth. We read this in Galatians and in the seven churches in Rev 2 and Rev 3. The Bible speaks for itself regarding this.
The church had gone very much astray by the time of the Reformation, when God raised up faithful men like Luther, Calvin, Knox and others along with the invention of the printing press that made Bibles available to the masses. Many of the Creeds and Confessions that define post-reformation churches and denominations were developed at that time and made giant steps toward correcting some of the false teachings prevalent in that day. But they were not infallible.
Unfortunately up until and including our day, very little in-depth Bible study and questioning by the churches of those Confessions has been done. And even worse, they came to have an authority in the churches equal to or more so than the Bible itself. But despite all this, God was very patient and longsuffering with the churches in continuing to use them as His primary means of getting the Gospel out into the world.
Today, however, if we examine what the churches are doing and teaching we find that the Bible has essentially lost its authority as we see activities and teachings within the churches that would never have been tolerated 50-75 years ago. And virtually every church teaches a do-it-yourself Gospel where WE need to DO something to become saved.
More later perhaps.
1 Timothy 6:9 talks about traps which "drown men in perdition." Let us consider for a moment how things will stand after the Rapture of the Church (assuming of course in a Pre-Trib rapture viewpoint). Before we tangle with what seems to be an impossible situation for those remaining on the earth to believe what just happened is anything other than calling His saints home to glory; let us rewind back to the time of Christ. In this time there clearly were many miracles which could only be attributed logically to God. (see John 9:32 and the healing of the blind man). Nonetheless; Satan (or Beelzebub which is a reference to an equally evil entity) was attributed to such things by the blind Pharisees. ( Matthew 12:22). This was despite the obvious fulfillment of prophecies which pertained to Christ from the Old Testament; not to mention his own prophetic warnings of crucifixion to come as well as the Resurrection seen by 500 ( 1 Cor. 15:1-11). Such hatred shows the blindness of the minds of men by the god of this world ( 2 Cor. 4:4); as well as our own state apart from the illumination of the Holy Spirit to such matters.
So looking ahead to the beginning of the Tribulation; we should expect more of the same. Evil will be unrestrained at that time unlike any time before or since ( Matt. 24:21). Since all but 8 died in Noah's flood; we expect therefore that the demons being loosened will be the thing making things worse since a number actually will physically survive to the end. A short inspection of the media today should clearly indicate how entrenched images of occult and Satanic worship has become acceptable to the mainstream. When we see undeniable and verifiable signs such as fire coming down from heaven that the False Prophet performs; it is no surprise the world embraces it; and worships the image (as well as likely creating it themselves perhaps on their own computers).
IT seems that with the downplay (if even being a factor at all) of coming to saving faith of repentance for individuals another issue is being unwilling to confront national evils which we are called to sound out against as per Ezekiel 33. There are several reasons for this; one being fear of societal disapproval or persecution; going against the grain of many who are rather lukewarm about the subject and the most insidious perhaps being our own tendancy to be overcomfortable as the pot approaches boiling as we see in the case of Lot. James 5:3 should be carefully read; as many think that through their own efforts they can make it through the Tribulation; or even be able to endure things before that should there be a crash in the metals market; or perhaps something else such as nuclear fallout that could render such wealth useless. There needs to be a healthy balance between wise prudence in resources and hoarding; the former being ideally used for other saints in a time of crisis as was in the book of Acts; and the latter being a tendency to fall into based on political persuasion being set above spiritual wisdom.
As with my first part in this series; it should be obvious that the crap will hit the fan; so to speak. Or; as I put it God is much more longsuffering than I am; considering the long list of abominations our own nation has committed; although hardly alone in such actions we have been the catalyst for expanding these horrors worldwide (abortion; pornography; illicit drug trade).
Whether we are Babylon or not; or a part of the final world system it is evident that destruction when it comes will be so speedy that there is no remedy to avoid the famine; plagues; war and demonic infestation of the earth at that time short of Divine Intervention and protection.
Satan will have his day in the spotlight; so let us work while it still is day. ( John 9:4).