I appreciate you and your reply. I drove 200 miles today; a bit weary. Thus my reply to yours will be shorter than I prefer at this time. And oh, no need to be sorry.
Although I've read Job, I don't remember Job 28:28. When I read Isaiah 45:7 along with it, it's somewhat confusing. I must now conclude that in order to gain understanding, I must depart from God to do so. Now I'm sorry, because I have to accept that God is evil because God is the Source of "Evil".
Evil makes evil just as fear makes fear and Love creates Itself. Could you please explain which quality you attribute to Satan; evil or love? Perhaps neither? Or maybe just one of these characteristics; if so, then I must assume God and Satan have something in common, and thus share a common purpose.
The New Testament claims if Satan opposes himself and is divided he cannot stand and his end has come. Actually, this principle applies to everything, including God. Personally, I don't believe God is divided. I do believe He is One.
The Bible also states in James that things produce what they are, not what they are not; and furthermore, both fresh water and its OPPOSITE, salt water, cannot flow from the same spring. Thus OPPOSITES cannot flow from the Mind of God. As I've suggested in the past, this would indicate that faith in Love AND fear is the result of a double-minded entity. If someone has faith in God Who is Love, then he MUST ALSO have faith in evil if God is Evil.
Quoting me Scripture is fine, of course. But, I'm fairly familiar with it, and can also read fairly well. What would be helpful is reconciling what appears as irreconcilable, i.e. opposing; with something unambiguous, leading to an obvious conclusion. This would be helpful also, because obviousness IS the essential characteristic of reality, i.e. truth. And I'm quite certain the ego is afraid of the obvious.
I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the Lord, and the praises of the Lord, according to all that the Lord hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his lovingkindnesses.
8 For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour.
9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old.
10 But they REBELLED, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he -THE HOLY SPIRIT- was turned to be their ENEMY, and he FOUGHT against them.
11 Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, Where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? where is he that put his holy Spirit within him?
Psalm 51:11-13
11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.
13 Then will I teach transgressors thy ways; and sinners shall be converted unto thee.
TKL said he "knows the reference "Holy Ghost" did not exist in the OT" .
1John 5:7-There are three that bear record in heaven,the Father,the Word,and the Holy Spirit(who is not a ghost as is written in English language,but a Person):and these three are One.
Actually the Holy Spirit as a person is very similar to the Son of man,my Lord JESUS,but he has no light of his own as JESUS has,he has not message of his own,as JESUS had and has,and he as a person is very unknown because he has no genealogy as JESUS has,he has a written name,it is quite true,but his name is unknown,no man knows the name of the person of the Holy Spirit,despite being written,and being he SIMILAR to the Son of man-JESUS.In other words,BY ANALOGY,JESUS is the Sun,the Sun of Righteousness,JESUS is the Greater Light,the Greater Luminary,but the person of the Holy Spirit has no light of his own,he is the Lesser Luminary,as the moon is in the Solar system,the moon has not his own light,its light is from the Sun,is the reflection of Solar light.
That said,the light that the person of the Holy Spirit reflects is not from Himself,no,it is not,absolutely not,in fact he reflects the Light that he receives from JESUS,as the moon receives the Light from the Sun. I say this by the Word of the Father,by the Word of my GOD, the Father, as JESUS said: John 16:12-15 &15:26
12 I still have much to say to you, but you cannot bear it now.
13But when that Spirit of truth comes,he will guide you into all truth, for HE WILL NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF,but he will speak whatever he hears and he will declare to you what is to come
14He will glorify me,for he will receive what is mine and declare it to you.
15All that the Father has is mine;therefore he told you that (HE)WILL RECEIVE WHAT IS MINE and will declare it to you.
The Person of the Holy Spirit is not a"Ghost" as is written in English language,the Person of the Holy Spirit is one of the three DISTINCTS Persons in GOD the Father,in the Word, the Word is GOD.
I agree with Bro. Dan. These verses come to mind. 2 Corinthians 2:6 "Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many". Hebrews 10:29 "Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?" Roman 11:22 sums up what Bro. Dan said. Note that this what we need to "behold" when we view God. "Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off."
Thank you so much for your reply. If I may ask, what prompted you to send me these two pieces of scripture from Matthew and Psalms?
I do agree with you that one single word can make a difference. I think that's why we as English speaking bible believers can't agree on certain things. English is such a general language where certain words can have multiple meanings.
If we take the word ghost and the word spirit, it's easy to see how we might come up with different meanings to those two words. But as Giannis has shared with you, the term Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit are the exact same in the original text which was used by those who translated that text into English.
So with what brother Giannis has shared, I don't believe there is a distinction between Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit.
The grk for Holy Ghost is Agio Pneuma, the grk for Holy Spirit is again Agio Pneuma. There is no difference. There is a difference in Engl. but in other languages there isn't such, especially in grk. Why did the translators of the KJB use the word ghost instead of spirit? Because it how it was called 400 years ago but not nowadays. The difference between OT and NT is not a matter of words but a matter of function. The Holy Spirit in the old days didn't dwel inside the bodies of believers, this was done after Jesus ascended to His Father after His resurrection and was given the Spirit who he since that time sends to believers .In the OT the Spirit did not reside permanently in any person, even in the case of the prophets, the Spirit was coming upon them, they prophesied and then He was gone until the next time. This is obvious in the case of Saul the first king. It says somewhere that the Spirit came to him and he prophesied, then the Spirit went away and an evil spirit came by and was torturing him, then after sometime again the Spirit came to him and prophesied again.thus showing that the Spirit was not residing permanently inside believers but was coming and going . GBU
John 5:43 I (the man, Jesus Christ) come in my Father's NAME and ye receive me (the spirit of truth) not: if another MAN come is his OWN NAME, him ye will receive.
You know them by their fruits.
Not their appearance, the words from their lips.
Isaiah 57:19 ..... I CREATE the FRUIT of the LIPS ..... ONLY when one is BAPTISED into the NAME of Jesus ...... does ones lips speak the same words as OUR LORD, the overseer of out lips.
Psalms 17:4 Concerning the works of men, by the words of THY LIPS (that that may be ONE as WE ARE ONE John 17:22) I have keep me from the paths of the destroyer.
Psalms 12:4 Who hath said.... our lips are our own......
1The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.
2Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem.
3And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.
4In that day, saith the LORD, I will smite every horse with astonishment, and his rider with madness: and I will open mine eyes upon the house of Judah, and will smite every horse of the people with blindness.
Verse 1 demonstrates that the God of all creation has specific plans for Israel. Verses 2-4 show how Armageddon will transpire; when all nations fight Israel and are drawn to Armageddon ( Rev. 16:13-14). Eventually as in other earlier campaigns; God's enemies in some part will start to fight one another; although Christ personally destroys the armies in the valley of Armageddon itself. These verses show what is happening first in Judah (the southern part of Israel) then in Jerusalem itself.
Verses 5 through 7 discuss the "governors of Judah" which may have been the representatives such as Nehamiah and those commissioned to rule by Persia at that time; but certainly there are end time ramifications here as to what I mentioned above; Judah being saved first.
Verse 8 then talks about supernatural strength against enemies among the residents of Jerusalem. Verse 9 shows how God Himself will fight against the enemies. The rest of the passage shows how those in Israel finally recognize their Messiah. Everyone mourns by themselves. Apparently it isn't until the brink of the Second Coming until there is national repentence for those still alive realizing finally who Christ really is and finally have remorse.
I agree that the OT customs of men having multiple wives and concubines/harems is unlike those of us in western civilization today. Jesus did clarify that in the beginning it was one man one wife. ( Matt. 19:8)(people marrying and divorcing and remarrying)
But due to the hardness of people's hearts, Moses allowed divorce. But Jesus did speak pretty plainly about divorce and remarriage and its relationship to adultery. Today, there is a hardening of people's hearts again concerning marriage, divorce, and remarriage. But just because many believe it is fine and most who divorce remarry doesn't make it right in today's world. I believe what Jesus said concerning divorce and remarriage. AND I will always be sensitive to those who are living against Jesus' standard, but I will not agree with them that it is morally o.k.
On this topic we will disagree, Jema. We can move on to other matters. I am glad you shared your view and I, too, want to be compassionate to others, but without compromising what Jesus has set as a correct moral standard.
As I quoted in my prior post,JESUS shewed unto His disciples His HANDS and His FEET- Luke 24:40.
You think that "Scripture does not give us that", but remember that our GOD said to the Serpent-> GEnesis 3:13-15 combined with Job 13:27:
13And the Lord GOD said unto the woman,What is this that thou hast done?And the woman said,The serpent beguiled me,and I did eat(i.e.the woman believed in the interpretation of the Word of GOD by the man of sin,son of perdition,called Serpent in Genesis.Today, i.e.in this time of Apocalypse,he is called red Dragon- Revelation 12).
14And the Lord GOD said unto the serpent,Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed...and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: (man was made of the dust",so once man fell deceived by the woman deceived by the man of sin,and still is until this current time, who is the son of perdition,in the beginning called Serpent.
In fact,all mankind was made/produced into the belly of the Serpent, EXCEPT JESUS,of course,my oldest brother,the firstborn among many brethren- Romans 8:29.By the way, GOD has a lot and countless sons,but there are two who are lawful GOD's sons,not by adoption-JESUS and the Comfort,the Paraclete,the Ancient of days.
15And I-GOD- will put enmity between thee and the woman(now the Church-the body of Christ-,and between thy seed(sons of Devil) and her seed(sons of GOD, true believers);it shall bruise thy head,and thou shalt bruise His heel.
Remember,JESUS said- Luke 20:35-36:
35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world(the next world-the millennial GOD's Kingdom- Revelation 11:15-18),and the resurrection from the dead(dead? Colossians 3:3-7.Take a look), neither marry,nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more:for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God,being the children of the resurrection ( Colossians 3:3-7 combined with 1Thessalonians 4:17 and 1Corinthians 15:51-55).
Psalm 51:10-11, "10Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. 11Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me."
The grk says the same word "Pneuma" for what the English attributes as "Ghost" and "Spirit". Ghost is maybe an archaic Engl. word for the modern term Spirit. Nevertheless it is the same word in grk, so it is the same person, the Spirit of God.
Thanks for your response to TKL concerning this conversation. I can see that you understand what I was getting at in responding to Jimbob about the Spirit of God being mentioned in the OT. The Scriptures do use several words for this Spirit as you stated. By the response to you and I it may seem that TKL and Jimbob think that the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, and the Spirit of God are not referring to the Holy Ghost. But maybe Jimbob was coming from a narrow view of the term Holy Ghost only being used int he NT. We don't know for sure unless they say so.
But, as you, I also could see where this conversation with Jimbob would go, and so kept my response to him narrow as well. I did not answer His questions because I don't know the answer or any of the other reasons he gave for my refusal. I did not answer nor wish to engage in the conversation further because it will only lead to him being continually confrontational and argumentative on this topic. I see that as being unfruitful and best to avoid it.
I do appreciate you speaking up for me. You are always kind and understand well where I am coming from. Thank you.
It is one thing to present one's viewpoint strongly and another thing to impugn another person's character. I choose not to do the latter. We both sensed well how conversing on this topic with Jimbob will go because there have been so many threads from him on this topic in the past few months that we know how he interacts with those who respond. We have chosen what is best for us and most healthy for all.
Hi Gigi , yes I have read Richards reply and he is totally entitled to believe what he does :) . With regard to the lack of divorces in the Bible , it's worth remembering that in Old Testament times there wasn't much need of it , if a man tired of his wife , he didn't divorce her , he just married another one , which of course is not permissible in our culture or religion . On the other side of the coin , if a woman was tired of her husband , she might be glad that he gets himself another wife as that would keep him occupied and away from her :) . I imagine that being able to be married to more than one person at a time , greatly changes the circumstances and therefore affects the different opinions on this matter . The Old Testament times and marriage customs were extremely different to the times that we live in now so it's very hard to compare them .
In my post I did say I only wished to comment about the spirit being mentioned in the OT. I do not wish to engage in conversation with you concerning translations of the Bible because your tone is argumentative.
Just so you know, I have never said I put my trust in translations other than the KJV. You are wrong on this. My trust is in God and trust He will lead me into truth.
As to your request for me to answer your queries, I choose not to give in to your demands. We have discussed this before and I do not wish to revisit this situation because your wording is aggressive towards me. It is just not in the right spirit in my estimation. I leave off of this conversation today in the name of peace.
I wish we could contact one another in a private way on here. I have suggested that to the ADMIN but did not receive a response back. I am sure it is possible to create a way to converse privately without giving out e-mail addresses, but instead using just our screen names but in a private aspect of this forum.
"And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it."
Firstly the Spirit repeats more or less the same words to indicate the Father Son relationship.
Let us examine another verse which is indeed the opposite. "My Father worketh hitherto, and I work" ( John 5:17) He spoke as the Word become flesh thereby tying heaven and the earth in the Word component. Christ the same (He.13:8) in terms of the Word (Is.55:11) . It shall never return to him in void.
Thus after his Ascension we have this verse from the writer to the Hebrews,"And upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins,"(He.1:3). As the brightness of His glory the word is out there corralling all the heirs of promise till they enter into the rest of God. "For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his./ Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief."(He.4:11).
When his Son ascended on high it was in accordance with the eternal covenant. And "when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high," it was also as the word had spoken,"The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool./The Lord shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies."(Ps.110:1-2). The same relationship and the same covenant and the works of the Son go on till all 'thine enemies' are destroyed, it is the Son working out of Zion. This is the seventh day that the Father sanctified.
"So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; It shall not return to Me void, But it shall accomplish what I please, And it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it."(Is.55:11-NKJV). The Spirit repeats in order to emphasize the Word, the voice and the sign shall prevail from eternity to eternity.
To meditate: Matt.5:14 New Jerusalem as a city descending from heaven.
The WILL of GOD is CAUSING all thing to fall under his will. God makes no mistakes, by suffering Christ learned obedience, a child
is TOLD, do not touch the stove, it is hot, a child has no knowledge, through suffering those hot stoves we GET KNOWLEDGE, through knowledge we LEARN obedience.
I appreciate you and your reply. I drove 200 miles today; a bit weary. Thus my reply to yours will be shorter than I prefer at this time. And oh, no need to be sorry.
Although I've read Job, I don't remember Job 28:28. When I read Isaiah 45:7 along with it, it's somewhat confusing. I must now conclude that in order to gain understanding, I must depart from God to do so. Now I'm sorry, because I have to accept that God is evil because God is the Source of "Evil".
Evil makes evil just as fear makes fear and Love creates Itself. Could you please explain which quality you attribute to Satan; evil or love? Perhaps neither? Or maybe just one of these characteristics; if so, then I must assume God and Satan have something in common, and thus share a common purpose.
The New Testament claims if Satan opposes himself and is divided he cannot stand and his end has come. Actually, this principle applies to everything, including God. Personally, I don't believe God is divided. I do believe He is One.
The Bible also states in James that things produce what they are, not what they are not; and furthermore, both fresh water and its OPPOSITE, salt water, cannot flow from the same spring. Thus OPPOSITES cannot flow from the Mind of God. As I've suggested in the past, this would indicate that faith in Love AND fear is the result of a double-minded entity. If someone has faith in God Who is Love, then he MUST ALSO have faith in evil if God is Evil.
Quoting me Scripture is fine, of course. But, I'm fairly familiar with it, and can also read fairly well. What would be helpful is reconciling what appears as irreconcilable, i.e. opposing; with something unambiguous, leading to an obvious conclusion. This would be helpful also, because obviousness IS the essential characteristic of reality, i.e. truth. And I'm quite certain the ego is afraid of the obvious.
Peace
I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the Lord, and the praises of the Lord, according to all that the Lord hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his lovingkindnesses.
8 For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour.
9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old.
10 But they REBELLED, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he -THE HOLY SPIRIT- was turned to be their ENEMY, and he FOUGHT against them.
11 Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, Where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? where is he that put his holy Spirit within him?
Psalm 51:11-13
11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.
13 Then will I teach transgressors thy ways; and sinners shall be converted unto thee.
TKL said he "knows the reference "Holy Ghost" did not exist in the OT" .
1John 5:7-There are three that bear record in heaven,the Father,the Word,and the Holy Spirit(who is not a ghost as is written in English language,but a Person):and these three are One.
Actually the Holy Spirit as a person is very similar to the Son of man,my Lord JESUS,but he has no light of his own as JESUS has,he has not message of his own,as JESUS had and has,and he as a person is very unknown because he has no genealogy as JESUS has,he has a written name,it is quite true,but his name is unknown,no man knows the name of the person of the Holy Spirit,despite being written,and being he SIMILAR to the Son of man-JESUS.In other words,BY ANALOGY,JESUS is the Sun,the Sun of Righteousness,JESUS is the Greater Light,the Greater Luminary,but the person of the Holy Spirit has no light of his own,he is the Lesser Luminary,as the moon is in the Solar system,the moon has not his own light,its light is from the Sun,is the reflection of Solar light.
That said,the light that the person of the Holy Spirit reflects is not from Himself,no,it is not,absolutely not,in fact he reflects the Light that he receives from JESUS,as the moon receives the Light from the Sun. I say this by the Word of the Father,by the Word of my GOD, the Father, as JESUS said: John 16:12-15 &15:26
12 I still have much to say to you, but you cannot bear it now.
13But when that Spirit of truth comes,he will guide you into all truth, for HE WILL NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF,but he will speak whatever he hears and he will declare to you what is to come
14He will glorify me,for he will receive what is mine and declare it to you.
15All that the Father has is mine;therefore he told you that (HE)WILL RECEIVE WHAT IS MINE and will declare it to you.
The Person of the Holy Spirit is not a"Ghost" as is written in English language,the Person of the Holy Spirit is one of the three DISTINCTS Persons in GOD the Father,in the Word, the Word is GOD.
Thank you so much for your reply. If I may ask, what prompted you to send me these two pieces of scripture from Matthew and Psalms?
I do agree with you that one single word can make a difference. I think that's why we as English speaking bible believers can't agree on certain things. English is such a general language where certain words can have multiple meanings.
If we take the word ghost and the word spirit, it's easy to see how we might come up with different meanings to those two words. But as Giannis has shared with you, the term Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit are the exact same in the original text which was used by those who translated that text into English.
So with what brother Giannis has shared, I don't believe there is a distinction between Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit.
Again, thank you for your reply!
May I intervene?
The grk for Holy Ghost is Agio Pneuma, the grk for Holy Spirit is again Agio Pneuma. There is no difference. There is a difference in Engl. but in other languages there isn't such, especially in grk. Why did the translators of the KJB use the word ghost instead of spirit? Because it how it was called 400 years ago but not nowadays. The difference between OT and NT is not a matter of words but a matter of function. The Holy Spirit in the old days didn't dwel inside the bodies of believers, this was done after Jesus ascended to His Father after His resurrection and was given the Spirit who he since that time sends to believers .In the OT the Spirit did not reside permanently in any person, even in the case of the prophets, the Spirit was coming upon them, they prophesied and then He was gone until the next time. This is obvious in the case of Saul the first king. It says somewhere that the Spirit came to him and he prophesied, then the Spirit went away and an evil spirit came by and was torturing him, then after sometime again the Spirit came to him and prophesied again.thus showing that the Spirit was not residing permanently inside believers but was coming and going . GBU
Christ is TRUTH
If you don't believe that the OLD TIME ( 2 Peter 1:21) is speaking of the Old Testament prophets then Luke 24:45 is FOR YOU, not me..
God Bless you, as the spirit of truth (Holy Ghost) destroyers you carnal mind.
Most believe what man says not what God says.
God's words are always fulfilled.
John 5:43 I (the man, Jesus Christ) come in my Father's NAME and ye receive me (the spirit of truth) not: if another MAN come is his OWN NAME, him ye will receive.
You know them by their fruits.
Not their appearance, the words from their lips.
Isaiah 57:19 ..... I CREATE the FRUIT of the LIPS ..... ONLY when one is BAPTISED into the NAME of Jesus ...... does ones lips speak the same words as OUR LORD, the overseer of out lips.
Psalms 17:4 Concerning the works of men, by the words of THY LIPS (that that may be ONE as WE ARE ONE John 17:22) I have keep me from the paths of the destroyer.
Psalms 12:4 Who hath said.... our lips are our own......
God Bless YOU!
God Bless YOU!
1The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.
2Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem.
3And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.
4In that day, saith the LORD, I will smite every horse with astonishment, and his rider with madness: and I will open mine eyes upon the house of Judah, and will smite every horse of the people with blindness.
Verse 1 demonstrates that the God of all creation has specific plans for Israel. Verses 2-4 show how Armageddon will transpire; when all nations fight Israel and are drawn to Armageddon ( Rev. 16:13-14). Eventually as in other earlier campaigns; God's enemies in some part will start to fight one another; although Christ personally destroys the armies in the valley of Armageddon itself. These verses show what is happening first in Judah (the southern part of Israel) then in Jerusalem itself.
Verses 5 through 7 discuss the "governors of Judah" which may have been the representatives such as Nehamiah and those commissioned to rule by Persia at that time; but certainly there are end time ramifications here as to what I mentioned above; Judah being saved first.
Verse 8 then talks about supernatural strength against enemies among the residents of Jerusalem. Verse 9 shows how God Himself will fight against the enemies. The rest of the passage shows how those in Israel finally recognize their Messiah. Everyone mourns by themselves. Apparently it isn't until the brink of the Second Coming until there is national repentence for those still alive realizing finally who Christ really is and finally have remorse.
I agree that the OT customs of men having multiple wives and concubines/harems is unlike those of us in western civilization today. Jesus did clarify that in the beginning it was one man one wife. ( Matt. 19:8)(people marrying and divorcing and remarrying)
But due to the hardness of people's hearts, Moses allowed divorce. But Jesus did speak pretty plainly about divorce and remarriage and its relationship to adultery. Today, there is a hardening of people's hearts again concerning marriage, divorce, and remarriage. But just because many believe it is fine and most who divorce remarry doesn't make it right in today's world. I believe what Jesus said concerning divorce and remarriage. AND I will always be sensitive to those who are living against Jesus' standard, but I will not agree with them that it is morally o.k.
On this topic we will disagree, Jema. We can move on to other matters. I am glad you shared your view and I, too, want to be compassionate to others, but without compromising what Jesus has set as a correct moral standard.
2 peter 1:21 for the prophecy came not in the old (testament) time by the will of man; but holy men of god spake as they were moved by the holy ghost.
god bless you!
It's a pleasure to hear from you,brother.
As I quoted in my prior post,JESUS shewed unto His disciples His HANDS and His FEET- Luke 24:40.
You think that "Scripture does not give us that", but remember that our GOD said to the Serpent-> GEnesis 3:13-15 combined with Job 13:27:
13And the Lord GOD said unto the woman,What is this that thou hast done?And the woman said,The serpent beguiled me,and I did eat(i.e.the woman believed in the interpretation of the Word of GOD by the man of sin,son of perdition,called Serpent in Genesis.Today, i.e.in this time of Apocalypse,he is called red Dragon- Revelation 12).
14And the Lord GOD said unto the serpent,Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed...and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: (man was made of the dust",so once man fell deceived by the woman deceived by the man of sin,and still is until this current time, who is the son of perdition,in the beginning called Serpent.
In fact,all mankind was made/produced into the belly of the Serpent, EXCEPT JESUS,of course,my oldest brother,the firstborn among many brethren- Romans 8:29.By the way, GOD has a lot and countless sons,but there are two who are lawful GOD's sons,not by adoption-JESUS and the Comfort,the Paraclete,the Ancient of days.
15And I-GOD- will put enmity between thee and the woman(now the Church-the body of Christ-,and between thy seed(sons of Devil) and her seed(sons of GOD, true believers);it shall bruise thy head,and thou shalt bruise His heel.
Remember,JESUS said- Luke 20:35-36:
35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world(the next world-the millennial GOD's Kingdom- Revelation 11:15-18),and the resurrection from the dead(dead? Colossians 3:3-7.Take a look), neither marry,nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more:for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God,being the children of the resurrection ( Colossians 3:3-7 combined with 1Thessalonians 4:17 and 1Corinthians 15:51-55).
Psalm 51:10-11, "10Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. 11Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me."
The grk says the same word "Pneuma" for what the English attributes as "Ghost" and "Spirit". Ghost is maybe an archaic Engl. word for the modern term Spirit. Nevertheless it is the same word in grk, so it is the same person, the Spirit of God.
GBU
Thanks for your response to TKL concerning this conversation. I can see that you understand what I was getting at in responding to Jimbob about the Spirit of God being mentioned in the OT. The Scriptures do use several words for this Spirit as you stated. By the response to you and I it may seem that TKL and Jimbob think that the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, and the Spirit of God are not referring to the Holy Ghost. But maybe Jimbob was coming from a narrow view of the term Holy Ghost only being used int he NT. We don't know for sure unless they say so.
But, as you, I also could see where this conversation with Jimbob would go, and so kept my response to him narrow as well. I did not answer His questions because I don't know the answer or any of the other reasons he gave for my refusal. I did not answer nor wish to engage in the conversation further because it will only lead to him being continually confrontational and argumentative on this topic. I see that as being unfruitful and best to avoid it.
I do appreciate you speaking up for me. You are always kind and understand well where I am coming from. Thank you.
It is one thing to present one's viewpoint strongly and another thing to impugn another person's character. I choose not to do the latter. We both sensed well how conversing on this topic with Jimbob will go because there have been so many threads from him on this topic in the past few months that we know how he interacts with those who respond. We have chosen what is best for us and most healthy for all.
Sharing a differing viewpoint is not being unkind. With that I will end this conversation with you, also.
In my post I did say I only wished to comment about the spirit being mentioned in the OT. I do not wish to engage in conversation with you concerning translations of the Bible because your tone is argumentative.
Just so you know, I have never said I put my trust in translations other than the KJV. You are wrong on this. My trust is in God and trust He will lead me into truth.
As to your request for me to answer your queries, I choose not to give in to your demands. We have discussed this before and I do not wish to revisit this situation because your wording is aggressive towards me. It is just not in the right spirit in my estimation. I leave off of this conversation today in the name of peace.
I wish we could contact one another in a private way on here. I have suggested that to the ADMIN but did not receive a response back. I am sure it is possible to create a way to converse privately without giving out e-mail addresses, but instead using just our screen names but in a private aspect of this forum.
Have a good day, Richard.
Thank you for your reply. I agree that this topic is a difficult one, especially in this time.
It is God that people are to answer to for their choices and not to the opinions of others.
Have you read Richard's reply? Perhaps you have something to say to his post since he seems to have given an answer to my question, too.
"And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it."
Firstly the Spirit repeats more or less the same words to indicate the Father Son relationship.
Let us examine another verse which is indeed the opposite. "My Father worketh hitherto, and I work" ( John 5:17) He spoke as the Word become flesh thereby tying heaven and the earth in the Word component. Christ the same (He.13:8) in terms of the Word (Is.55:11) . It shall never return to him in void.
Thus after his Ascension we have this verse from the writer to the Hebrews,"And upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins,"(He.1:3). As the brightness of His glory the word is out there corralling all the heirs of promise till they enter into the rest of God. "For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his./ Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief."(He.4:11).
When his Son ascended on high it was in accordance with the eternal covenant. And "when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high," it was also as the word had spoken,"The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool./The Lord shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies."(Ps.110:1-2). The same relationship and the same covenant and the works of the Son go on till all 'thine enemies' are destroyed, it is the Son working out of Zion. This is the seventh day that the Father sanctified.
"So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; It shall not return to Me void, But it shall accomplish what I please, And it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it."(Is.55:11-NKJV). The Spirit repeats in order to emphasize the Word, the voice and the sign shall prevail from eternity to eternity.
To meditate: Matt.5:14 New Jerusalem as a city descending from heaven.
Our only hint of the nails driven into Christ lower limbs is found in:
Job 13:27 ... thou settest a print in the heels of my feet.......
God Bless YOU!
Ephesians 4:4 ....ONE Spirit ...... called by different names.
God Bless YOU!
I'm sorry but the scriptures DO NOT agree with you.
John 5:14 "Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee."
Jesus warns that if we continue sinning only worse things will happen!
Proverbs 1:7
"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction."
Matthew 10:28
"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."
Proverbs 14:2
"He that walketh in his uprightness feareth the LORD: but he that is perverse in his ways despiseth him."
Job 28:28
"And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding."
God is FEAR and LOVE! If we are wise we will love Him and fear Him!
GBU
The WILL of GOD is CAUSING all thing to fall under his will. God makes no mistakes, by suffering Christ learned obedience, a child
is TOLD, do not touch the stove, it is hot, a child has no knowledge, through suffering those hot stoves we GET KNOWLEDGE, through knowledge we LEARN obedience.
Good questions.
Does God tell us not to do something, then turn around and CAUSE US to do it.
YES!
God told the children NOT TO marry outside their tribe.
Samson was told by his mother and father that GOD SAID NOT TO marry a Philistine.
Judges 14:4 But his father and mother KNEW NOT it was of the LORD that he (God) sought an occasion AGAINST the Philistines.
God told David NOT TO number ISRAEL:
2 Samuel 24:1 ...and God MOVED David to go and number Israel.
God Bless YOU!
It is also truly good to see someone else defending the Inspired Word of God on this site, sadly not many do!
Every Word of God is pure! ( Proverbs 30:5-6)
Growing daily should be important to every one of us.
God Bless you TKL.